Everything has changed in space travel in recent years.
Rolf Densing, director of the European Space Agency ESA for mission operations, has been involved for a long time.
He has strongly influenced the European space strategy - and in recent years has also seen the rise of private providers.
ESA has long been working with such providers itself.
For example, with a Swiss start-up that is developing something like a garbage disposal probe for space debris on behalf of ESA.
"Anyone who is here likes to stay long," says Densing in an event of the FAZ series "Club of Clever Minds" and in the Digitec podcast.