Carlos Marín Ballester: "I have already exceeded 100,000 78 rpm records and 2,000 phonograph cylinders"

• Incredible collectors: The 9,000 old posters of the guardian of advertising in Spain

• Carlos Areces: "Where there is an unpublished drawing by Ibáñez, my desire is to get it"

• Mur, from a position in El Rastro to gather one of the best collections on photography and cinema

• Cristina Ortega: "I have between 3,000 and 4,000 garments from 1900 to the 50s. From the 60s to the 80s, about 50,000"

• Luis González: "My cassette factory has surpassed the record label"

• Diego Dámaso, the largest Scalextric collector in Europe

Carlos Marín Ballester defines himself as a specialist in Spanish sound heritage.

A polyhedral dedication that has made him collect and analyze the largest collection of audio files in our country, a company that began, without knowing it, because of

to get to know the Flemish creators better

From then on, and as his studies expanded, he understood that he should complement it with "as much documentation as possible from the record companies: catalogues, supplements, photographs...".

Over time, and by acquiring entire collections, Marín Ballester no longer only dedicated himself to the study of flamenco, but he also began to save "

On the one hand the political, on the other the scientific, the literary, or cultural or social expressions," he explains. And so he went on to also acquire

as Ramón y Cajal, Juan de la Cierva , Lorca (at the piano), Ortega y Gasset, Franco or Primo de Rivera, among the hundreds of voices, music, stories, speeches or advertisements that populate its shelves.

QUESTION.- How did you get started in this collection?

ANSWER.-

Since I was very young I have always been very fond of music, in general, and also of records, because today it seems that you can be fond of music and the medium is not linked to it.

But at that time, I speak of the 80s, because it was something intimately linked.

So always

Around the year 93 approximately,

the slate record, through my love of flamenco.

Let's say that I wanted to listen beyond what I managed to enjoy in live flamenco, and also in what was recorded on vinyl.

So, almost by obligation,

And that's where I started, buying a record at

.

Q.- But 30 years ago you were very young...

A.-

Yes. I am from 74, that is, I was 18 or 19 years old when I started.

One day I went to the Rastro and there, in Solís' store, in Vara del Rey, which unfortunately no longer exists,

I am from Madrid, and part of my family is Andalusian, from Almería, but I have always lived here, except for two years when I lived in Almería.

There I had already started buying a lot of vinyl, I mean flamenco vinyl.

I had a lot of vinyl but at an amateur level, listening to it.

When I returned from Almería to Madrid, that was when I began to come into contact with the world of the 78 record, the slate record, as they say here in Spain, and the moment I started walking around, It was already something that absorbed me and I understood that it was something more than a format that allowed me to listen to the singers,

Q.- And where did your love of flamenco come from?

A.-

It was an almost unexpected issue.

There was a hobby in my family, my grandfather and my father.

Both were fans of very different generations, logically, but for reasons of life I could not be with them for a long time because they died when I was little, between 10 and 19 years old.

So the truth is that on the flamenco side I couldn't have much of a relationship with them.

Then I do not know.

Those strange coincidences that life has... I felt a certain connection to flamenco as music.

and as I say, live flamenco, which has always interested me a lot, I felt that it should be completed, so to speak, with the

and that at the same time in flamenco it is so present, worth the redundancy, because the artists and especially from the 50s to here, have lived a lot from recreation and from going to the sources, and from reinterpreting what they heard... It seemed essential to me to have both feet on both worlds.

Q.- And I imagine that in order to play these 78 records you would start buying gramophones...

A.-

I started buying records when I still didn't have a player, because I had a player that belonged to my father, a Dual Bettor, with a robust German motor that was quite successful in the 70s in Spain, but it didn't turn well. to 78. So I

of that feeling that I

was

Although I knew that there were huge collections back then, or that they seemed to me and that I was late for everything, for all the trains.

But let's say that at first I started that way, then yes, I started buying some original jukeboxes, but after a short time I realized that in order to really listen to the records I had to use a

and that's it I entered the world of audio, which is another world apart.

Q.- Can you tell us a little more about this technical part?

A.-

The reproduction of 78 records or previous phonograph cylinders has a romantic issue if the original devices of the time are used, but

it is essential to do so .

with electric players, firstly because

and secondly, because

They allow you to play with different measures, because not all the grooves were the same, far from it.

The industry at that time was evolving, and therefore one finds himself with small or great challenges in each of the albums in front of him.

So, if you are very obsessive, as is my case, about seeking the purest sound and being able to get as close as possible to how those artists sang, or how they performed, that world of audio and perfecting that system, allows you to get closer each time a little more than that could be.

Q.- And from that first album, how did the collection evolve?

A.-

On the one hand, I felt that I had arrived late to the world of 78, of the 78 record, at that time I thought so... In fact, most people told me: man, it's very good, but the good time had been the 50's and 60's when vinyl arrived, and everyone was liquidating the 78 record... or when the radios in the 60's or 70's liquidated those archives... I said: well, yes, I have arrived late to everything, but that made me put more energy into all that activity.

So, at first, almost out of necessity and virtue of necessity, I understood that

that as it used to be done by fans, that maybe a fan of cante, if he likes Jerez or liked Cádiz, maybe Levante's cante interests him less and he pecks more... At that moment I understood that it had to be as open as possible in order to be able to incorporate more and more material, but also to understand

something that later, over time, I have been grateful for, because the study of flamenco, and the whole question At an academic level, how it has been studied over the course of the last 20 or 30 years, has gone hand in hand with that vision that I had of

I started buying loose records in antique stores.

Sure, it was a pre-internet era.

Then I traveled a lot throughout Spain, visiting antique dealers, creating contacts, buying selected records at first, then lots, finally collections, because when they got to know you, well, it

even if you were interested in a few records.

And based on insisting a lot, because I managed to get hold of a huge number of records from which I was selecting what was going to be the collection.

which later opened up everything related to Andalusia and

Q.- You made the collection a way of life, how did you start to be able to live from it?

A.-

The first years, when I returned to Madrid, and I saw that what the studio was, the research into the history of recorded sound in Spain and also, of course, the flamenco creators of that period, was a question that completely absorbed me.

It coincided with the fact that I was studying law, which was a career that had absolutely nothing to do with me, so what I did was an almost natural transition.

to make that selection, but after a short time, after two or three years, obviously I had to give my life a professional meaning and on the other hand I was making collection of a quantity of material that although musically interested me, at the collection level, no.

Q.- How did your family take that you left straight?

R.-

My mother did not take it well.

Logically, like all mothers.

And furthermore, at that time none of us could imagine the scale that this whole project has since taken.

At that time it was like starting a path without knowing where it could lead you.

But well, yes, the truth is that it was a complicated decision, but fortunately after a short time I was making selections from other musical genres that did not interest me at the collection level, that is, opera, especially, zarzuela, South American music, jazz, and so on.

And of course, it was a time when the Internet was beginning, so I did

at the collection level.

I started working for the then incipient Ebay, and shortly after I realized that it would be convenient for me to have my own web page for the

on a quarterly basis so that collectors, musicologists and institutions that were interested in the rest of the genres that, as I say, were not part of my collection.

I started from the year 2000, I think it was, twenty-odd years ago, and that's how the activity has been developing.

Obviously that forced me to redouble my efforts when it came to buying more collections and so on, until

and then, in recent years, the activity is not that it has been transformed, but it has been completed with that other branch,

Q.- And I imagine that you come into contact with other collectors...

A.-

Yes. I have hundreds or thousands of contacts of collectors, both in Spain and especially throughout the world.

This allows us to have continuous contact with all of them and to be able to complete certain recording series,

Q.- Tell us a little about it...

A.-

Sometimes it is not easy to show the importance of this issue.

That is to say, the

so those of us interested in the music of that period have to go without any other choice to the commercial records that went on sale, and to search for those records many decades after when they were commercialized, because one of the many inconveniences that one finds is that

It is difficult to find first-hand discs in perfect condition.

So, generally when you start a collection you buy a document, be it a poster, a record or whatever, and keep that document and that's it.

But in my case, I insist, because of the importance I give to the quality of the sound, I saw clearly that it was necessary not to collect, but to

in such a way that over the years, the thousands and thousands and thousands of records that enter or are acquired,

in such a way that most of the copies are in an excellent state of conservation and give us, shall we say,

This is also something that favors the result of book-disc editions.

Q.- I suppose that the advancement of new technologies in terms of audio editing, noise reduction, etc. will also play an important role.

A.-

The evolution that has taken place, above all, on the one hand, in

and on the other hand also in

such as clicks, blows, etc.

What happens is that in that case I'm something of a purist, let's say, to call myself something.

As my sound technician, Víctor Tomé, says,

When one goes to digitize, for example, a collection in a public archive, the disk that is there is that and perhaps it is a single take and no other solution can be adopted.

But when we're talking about your own collection records, as long as you have a copy in a state like it's never been played, pretty much all you have to do on that record is

You have to remove a little surface noise, but in that case I'm not much given to intervening much digitally at the editing level, because in the remastering process some things are gained, but others are lost, and those harmonics or that richness natural that the recording has sometimes, for wanting to eliminate certain defects or certain noises that sound a little different to the modern ear, that freshness that the recording has is left behind.

So, in this aspect I am firmly convinced that what has to be done is to

Q.- When was the Círculo Flamenco de Madrid

, of which you are president

A.-

I began to go to peñas a lot.

Then there was the Peña Chaquetón, in Madrid, which brought the best of flamenco in an intimate and small atmosphere and which

and with whom we were very lucky to be able to enjoy their art.

I always had contact with the peñas over time, the peñas and also all the flamenco that was developing in Madrid through the Caja Madrid Festival or the Albéniz Theater, at the Conde Duque, then in Colón, where the Fernán Gómez Theater, the Cultural Center of the Villa, etc.

There was a lot of flamenco activity in Madrid, and I was a pretty intense fan, in that sense.

Then I was in other flamenco clubs, sometimes programming some of the concerts and others, and we always had the idea in our conversations that it was necessary to develop in Madrid a kind of... I don't know if it's an association center, a club, an athenaeum. .. We can call it in many ways, something linked to flamenco, but

but to develop a slightly broader program around this music.

And then, in 2013, we saw the possibility of starting that project.

We were a group of friends, about 20 people, and together we put together what were going to be the fundamental columns of the circle in the sense of

etc.

It was going to be a non-profit cultural association that is supported by membership fees, without any type of public or private link, and therefore, totally independent for good and bad. Since then we have been almost ten years running.

Q.- Returning to the collection, tell me about that other part that encompasses culture, society, science or politics.

A.-

It is not easy to put a name to that part of the collection, that is already a statement, because of course, there are non-performative genres, but then there are others, obviously, that are sung musical genres and others.

So I always say that they are

On the one hand the political, on the other the scientific, the literary, or cultural or social expressions, such as radio, football, bullfighting, cinema, advertising, that type of genre that among all, the sum of all they make up what could be the society of the time.

Obviously the rest of the music is left out, let's say more of a playful nature.

But these other recordings that have added value in terms of the other information they provide, that is what interested me from the beginning and there we find,

that is,

And there one finds very interesting recordings

but also from many other prisms, because it also tells you surprises on a musical level and others.

Let's say that it is that part of the collection that is very varied and very interesting

or thereabouts that the wax cylinder began to be used for what it was to be, an object of commerce, so to speak, in All that time, those 15 years or so,

Family-level communication that separates them by an ocean, or they even

or phonograph cylinder.

Today we have to look back and try to place ourselves at that time to understand the magnitude of Edison's invention and all those who preceded it and those who in some way helped make all this become what it was later.

We are very fortunate when it comes to being able to try to understand what happened throughout the century with those two world wars, with the civil war itself, with the loss of the Spanish colonies... and

Q.- Any example?

A.-

For example, at the political level we have all the national anthems.

On the one hand, the

for example.

In cylinder we have the first versions, then we have recordings of

all the propaganda recordings made by the rebel side... The recordings that were made in Barcelona , also from the loyal side the Republic, all the recordings around anarchist hymns, from the CNT... That's for the political part, but for the part linked to culture we have everything.

From the recordings, for example, of

Q.- What does that recording consist of?

A.- It is the only testimony we have of Federico,

the Gramophone company made a series of five albums that were sold with a certain frequency and profusion... We have the complete collection in the archive.

We also have a section dedicated to Federico in which there are also recordings of Lola Membrives performing some of his works and other actresses who accompanied him and who participated in his projects, such as Tubau and some more... that is,

Q.- You do not rule out that your own voice may appear, of which there is no known recording to date.

A.-

Yes. Let's see if it appears, it

Acetates as they are often called, which are not exactly acetates.

They are immediate recording discs, like what I was commenting on about home recordings that could be made.

Generally, radio broadcasts sometimes made a disc of these metallic ones to keep as a souvenir or whatever.

But hey, we never lose hope.

Q.- Have you had any surprises, either with famous or anonymous people?

A.-

That intra-history that exists at the family level, those recordings that appear...

, or how one discovers certain family complexities through that recordings, it has always been interesting to me, not as a curiosity or as morbidity, but as a way of getting to know the society of the time better.

On the other hand, as protagonists of the 20th century we find everything.

One of the milestones of the collection was a conference divided into several immediate recording discs from the year 34, I seem to remember, by

There are very interesting recordings of this type.

A large number of the protagonists of the history of Spain in very different fields are present in the collection.

In the 'Archive of the Word' there is

is

Q.- Are they edited?

A.-

No, we haven't started that part yet.

Three volumes have come out dedicated to three fundamental figures of flamenco, in the editorial line most attached to that music, but

to make those other parts known of the collection linked to other genres, and that is where the collection will begin with a volume dedicated to politics, etcetera, etcetera, and with a certain periodicity to be able to show those other branches of the collection.

And also contextualizing them and accompanying them with studies a little along the lines of flamenco, but let's say

Q- How many albums do you have now, were they about 100,000?

A.- We must have already exceeded that figure of 100,000 78 records and about 2,000 phonograph cylinders,

and of which, those linked to Andalusia or the history of Spain are around between 15 and 20,000 records and between 600 or 700 cylinders .

Q.- What exactly are the cylinders?

A.-

As I mentioned before,

There had already been advances to record the music and so on, but the human voice was the big challenge.

In that case, Edison was the one who managed to develop it and, above all, who gave it that impetus more linked to industry and commerce.

In the first moments, in 1877, it was a phonograph cylinder that had a cylindrical mandrel

where a sheet of tin or silver was placed, which was where the recording membrane was inserted, and as I said before, a few years later it was when the wax cylinder as a recording medium.

That recording medium was already the one that remained the recording standard from 1893-94...

Q.- Who are the pioneers here?

A.-

There were several pioneers here, one of them,

who was one of the

He was the introducer of cinema across the French border into the Basque Country and then through Spain.

since he was a visionary.

And in the world of the phonograph he was the great protagonist of that period.

Also

There were quite a few pioneers of phonography in Spain, which above all were concentrated in Madrid, Valencia and Barcelona.

So, as I was saying, that period was fantastic because

And it was the step prior to the development of the phonographic industry through the flat disc, the disc as we know it,

There was a period of the phonograph that lasted in Spain until approximately 1904, although Some phonographic cabinets were lengthened a little more, which coexisted with the 78 record, which, as I say, began in 1899, and as soon as the record began to develop technically, it ended up displacing the cylinder, which became obsolete and began to disappear.

Q.- Have you also been collecting the players?

A.-

Yes, above all I focus on phonographs.

I have a special fondness for that sound prehistory.

I have been very selective over the years

always with the idea of ​​at some point developing a more ambitious, broader project, which we started some time ago, which is slow, but which will

here in Chamberí, where the different collections that we have been talking about are kept there, as well as the recording studio, the general record archive, etc.

The part that is in my home now will be moved, another part that is divided into two premises... Everything will be grouped there and from there all the activities that are being carried out up to now will be carried out, but in a slightly more informal or less organized, because obviously it is difficult to carry out as many projects as we do.

That way it can be done in a more organized way.

Q.- You have also been interested in the publications of the time, player manuals, etc., which would be the documentary part of the collection...

A.-

Yes, exactly.

Also at that time, when I started buying 78 flamenco records, I saw clearly that I was looking for the recording to be able to enjoy it, get to know the singer better, the repertoire he was doing... But that made me little Little did I realize that I needed to observe that phenomenon that resulted from someone who stood in front of a microphone in the year 15 or in the year 20, from all possible angles.

Serve as support for all kinds of

Then other collection lines were opened that have to do with all the flamenco artists who recorded in that period, and we have an archive of thousands and thousands and thousands of photographs, many of them signed... Also posters.

We're talking about almost 2,000 units.

Let's say that with the history of recorded sound in Spain, on the one hand as a nucleus and on the other hand flamenco, these other adjacent collections were generated.

Q.- Do you receive any kind of institutional support?

A.-

No, no.

Not until now.

Let's say that there are lines of aid, subsidies and others that are published each year for different types of entities or natural or legal persons, and on some occasions we participate in some of them.

But come on,

because from outside it is usually understood that this job is already done from the public.

But when one is inside one realizes that if this were the case, a collection of this magnitude could not have been made, and continuing with the argument, if this has happened it is because things are not being done well or as well as they should be. , and that there are spaces through which it is not that people like me sneak in, but on the contrary, that

that if collectors like the ones who star in this series did not exist, then unfortunately we would not have a good part of the musical memory of our country.

So I obviously do not rule out receiving support at some point from an institution, both public and private, sensitive to sound heritage.

But so far I haven't found it.

Sometimes I have more to do with foreign institutions than with Spanish ones, and I see with admiration how

between institutions dedicated to the protection and conservation or safeguarding, as we want to call it, at the public level, but also those other institutions at the private level, without which it would be impossible to understand that conservation process.

And they have an ongoing relationship and a dialogue and cooperation, something that here in Spain does not usually happen.

Q.- Can you show us any other part of the collection?

A.-

As I mentioned before, everything is linked to the 78 album. I always considered that the best way to enjoy that music was knowing all the possible details.

In this case, one of the avenues of knowledge was the compilation of all the material from the record companies.

A part of the collection is all the catalogs and record supplements.

and here we have, for example, an album dedicated to the

company , in this case it is the period in which

was the illustrator of most of the monthly supplements.

It is an essential material because

and other details that I sometimes explain at conferences and in books, such as that

and some of them took years to come out to the market.

Q.- Unlike books or records that may be more accessible, where do you get these catalogues?

R.- Esto al ser material efímero no tiene un mercado muy establecido, uno lo puede encontrar desde en anticuarios, ferias del papel, coleccionistas en general... Un poco de todo. Es una labor muy compleja y hay que ir afinando mucho, porque claro, estamos hablando de ir buscando los meses que te faltan de determinadas series y no es nada sencillo, pero bueno, la verdad es que cuando uno va completando esa serie de grabaciones es una satisfacción enorme. Se trata de intentar formar ese rompecabezas de la industria del sonido en España.

Otra parte de la colección, otra más, es el tema de las imágenes relacionadas con los protagonistas de esa historia sonora, en este caso, como mi campo de investigación y de especialización es el flamenco y músicas vinculadas a Andalucía, desde el principio tuve muy claro que tenía que hacer acopio de todo ese material gráfico de los grandes protagonistas que hubieran grabado en discos de 78. Este por ejemplo es un álbum de Antonia Mercé, La Argentina, la gran la gran figura de la danza española, que llegó a realizar grabaciones tanto en Francia como en España. Y por tanto, se halla presente también en la colección. Aquí la tenemos condecorada por Azaña, en la República.

P.-¿Te ayuda alguien con la colección?

R.- Sí, tengo una ayuda imprescindible porque Zaida [su mujer] es especialista en patrimonio sonoro, en didáctica de la música y también en Historia del Arte. Entonces la verdad es que nos complementamos muy bien en este campo de la conservación. Hay que desarrollar muchos proyectos y uno solo es imposible. Incluso nosotros nos sentimos en algunas ocasiones exhaustos ante todo lo que tenemos por delante, pero es una labor que consideramos necesaria y vamos a seguir adelante contra viento y marea. Archivos que conozco públicos que no manejan tantísimo volumen de información como este, cuentan con una plantilla de gente especialistas o no que trabajan y que van sacando adelante los proyectos como pueden, pero es que en este caso ha sido durante muchos años casi una labor unipersonal entonces, claro, es complicado cuando uno llega al momento de divulgar a la par que sigue adquiriendo y conservando, porque esto es una carrera hasta el final, uno no dice que ya ha terminado la colección, siempre va a estar en formación, pero cuando uno ya tiene claro que ha llegado el momento de empezar a compartir, eso no se puede hacer de cualquier manera, y ahí sí que se necesitan ciertos apoyos. Vivimos en el país que vivimos, que es maravilloso para muchísimas cosas, pero para el cuidado de la cultura y del patrimonio ya sabemos lo que sucede. Sensibilizando y haciendo ver que como país tenemos que ofrecer otras muchas cosas que además de nuestros grandes atractivos turísticos. Nos destacamos sobre todo de nuestros vecinos por nuestro enorme patrimonio y creatividad. Pues qué mejor que conservar todo eso que hemos logrado reunir y ponerlo a disposición tanto de quienes nos visitan como de quienes quieren entender mejor esta cultura española desde cualquier parte del mundo. Hoy, afortunadamente, a través de la digitalización, desde internet puedes tener acceso cualquier persona.

P.- Un punto en común que tenéis los grandes coleccionistas es que al final siempre queréis compartir ese patrimonio que habéis recopilado con el resto de la sociedad.

R.- Sí, sin duda. Por lo menos en mi caso. Yo lo tuve muy claro desde el principio. Quizá también porque tuve que padecer a veces a esos coleccionistas que con más o menos razones tenían una actitud huraña ante ante todo lo que tuviera que ver con el exterior. Yo en mi caso siempre tuve muy claro que estaba haciendo una labor necesaria, pero que no era para mí nada más, sino que era para la sociedad y para compartir ese conocimiento. Si no fuera así, considero que toda esta labor hubiera sido un auténtico fracaso, porque si se hubiera limitado simplemente a hacer acopio de materiales, entonces no sería nada más que la mitad de la mitad de lo que soy.

P.- ¿Podemos escuchar algunos de los discos de 78?

Claro, he traído unas muestras. Mira, este es de Plácido Domingo padre, este es José Antonio Primo de Rivera en tres idiomas español, inglés y francés. Este es el de Ramón Franco, del vuelo del Plus Ultra. Aquí tenemos al maestro Rodrigo tocando él mismo el piano en una grabación prácticamente desconocida, tocando él mismo sus propias composiciones, 'Preludio al gallo mañanero' y una pastoral. Aquí tenemos, por ejemplo, ya del 'Archivo de la Palabra' que realizó el Centro de Estudios Históricos a Ramón y Cajal, por ejemplo, o de Ortega y Gasset, los dos álbumes completos del 'Archivo de la Palabra'. En este caso, por ejemplo, lo hemos comentado antes, uno de los discos que componen la conferencia que se puede leer aquí, 'Conferencia Señor de la Cierva, 9 de marzo de 1934', en el que habla de todo el desarrollo que realizó del autogiro hasta que se convirtió en el prototipo definitivo. Aquí uno de Catalina Bárcena, un disco en torno a la mujer. Aquí uno de 'La vida es sueño', un recitado de Ricardo Calvo. Otro vinculado al fútbol, 'Los Leones Rojos', una marcha dedicada al equipo de nacional de fútbol, discos cómicos, en este caso de Tip y Top. Algunos discos de publicidad, por ejemplo la canción del Cola-Cao. Este de Mariquita Pérez. Aquí hay uno vinculado a la radio también o aquí, por ejemplo, de Lola Membrives recitando 'Bodas de sangre'. Este es un disco grabado en Uruguay. Por aquí un disco de contenido infantil. Había muchos cuentos infantiles grabados sobre todo en los años 20, 30 y 40. Se desarrolló mucho el catálogo en la parte infantil. En esa época el gramófono comenzó a democratizarse, a reducirse los precios y en torno al año 28 ya cuando estaba bien desarrollada la grabación eléctrica, el gramófono no era un artículo de lujo, sino que ya comenzó a entrar en todas las casas o en muchas casas y por tanto, en muchas familias ya podían tener una pequeña colección de discos. Y entonces los discos infantiles eran una pieza interesante dentro de los hogares.

P.- ¿En qué época me has dicho?

R.- La grabación eléctrica llegó en el año 25. En España, sobre todo en el año 26 y en torno al año 28 la industria pegó un acelerón. Del 28 a la guerra fue una época dorada de la industria de la industria del disco de 78. Y entonces ahí ya sí se desarrollaron muchas de las partes del catálogo que hasta ese momento a lo mejor estaban menos explotadas.

La parte infantil fue una de ellas. Es muy interesante también por la parte visual de las carpetas, que por aquel entonces no era lo habitual, porque los discos de 78 no llevaban una carpeta como los discos de vinilo. Generalmente eran sobres de papel y que no tenían un componente gráfico y de diseño, como luego tuvieron los discos de vinilo.

P.- ¿Y estos cilindros?

R.- Todos estos cilindros son de flamenco, hay aproximadamente doscientos y pico largos, casi 300, y hay de todos los fabricantes, de todos los gabinetes fonográficos, como se llamaban en aquella época, desde alguno de los pioneros, como hemos comentado antes, Armando Hugens, que en sociedad con Acosta desarrollaron uno de los gabinetes más importantes, y del resto de establecimientos en Madrid, Valencia, Barcelona y muchas otras comunidades. Aramburu, Ureña, José Navarro... en fin, de todos, y también hay una parte de cilindros Edison que también se grabaron cilindros fonográficos de contenido español en los

America's Edison Recording Studios.

Recordings were also made in Cuba, in Argentina, and above all, logically, they were carried out here in Spain.

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