Knowing a real era, eyes are clear
——Interview with Li Lu, director and chief producer of "The World"
The appearance of the TV series "The World" seems to be a doomed thing - it is to flow out naturally at this node.
At first, Li Lu read the novel "The World" in one breath, and was moved by the "depth of people" in the work, which also inspired his deep desire to create realistic themes.
Then, on the black land in the northeast where the cold wind roared, Li Lu, like the commander-in-chief, laid the "foundation" first, and then built the building of the TV series "The World" layer by layer.
As a result, an epic picture of a Chinese family spanning 50 years was slowly unfolded with the Zhou family as the center.
A small northern city, a group of busy people, shows thousands of life styles in the world.
Our conversation with Li Lu was about "The World", not just "The World".
From here, Li Lu has a deeper understanding of the development of domestic dramas and how to go out, and will meet more challenges in the future.
As he said: "It is not easy to truly present human emotions and tell real stories well, but it is a required course for telling Chinese stories well."
Li Lu
National first-class director, famous producer, his main representative works include TV series "The Happiness of the Boss", "In the Name of the People", "The Procuratorial Team", etc. His works have won many authoritative awards in the industry such as China TV "Golden Eagle Award" and "Flying Award".
Li Lu has long adhered to the creative concept of "feeling and strength", and has formed an artistic style with unique themes, attention to reality, and close to the times.
-Reporter Wang Yi
Telling an era from a "head-up" perspective
Liberation Weekend: "The World" has set off a wave of chasing dramas for all age groups. After the finale, it is still popular, far beyond your expectations, right?
Li Lu: I didn't expect this drama to hit the audience so thoroughly.
Many viewers said that their eyes lit up after watching "The World" because the tears washed away the dirt.
Knowing a most real era, my eyes have become clear.
Liberation Weekend: As a director, have you ever cried?
Li Lu: I am actually a person with a high tear point, and I hardly cry in my life.
But when filming this movie, sometimes tears flow naturally.
Bingkun's father and son's "reconciliation", the old worker who wants to detonate himself, and Sun Xiaoning going south to work, etc. I was very moved.
We patted and patted, and often there were people crying around the monitor.
I think everyone's "point" is different. This point is related to experience. For example, someone who has been laid off around him, who has experienced family life, old age, sickness and death, and who has had misunderstanding, entanglement or even hatred with his relatives will be judged when they see the corresponding plot. Touched, you will also see yourself in the play.
Liberation Weekend: You once said that you most want the work "The World" to speak for the fathers and "awaken" the current society.
What would you most like to say for your parents?
"Wake up" what?
Li Lu: What we wake up is our feelings for family, and what we wake up is the kind of family and friendship that is missing between people due to the rapid development of society.
In the past, neighbors didn't have to say hello when they went to eat at other houses, but now everyone lives in the same building and they don't know each other. How many years have passed?
In the past, our friends often met each other, but now we are more connected by mobile phones. How many years have passed since then?
We are so easy to forget.
I hope to let people "remember" that they don't "look up" or "look down" on anyone or any era, but tell stories calmly and tell the stories of that era from a "look up" perspective.
Watching this drama, older people will think that they were like this back then, and some scenes are vivid in their minds; young people will know that your uncle was laid off like this, your aunt was like this in business, and your father was like this when he was in school. Connected at that time.
Firmly believe that warmth is the foundation of life
Liberation Weekend: The whole drama of "The World" constantly amplifies the goodness and beauty of ordinary people. Is this intentional?
Li Lu: This is what I have always adhered to. Just like the "Boss's Happiness" and "Hawthorn Tree Love" that I filmed before, I generally like dramas with warm tones as the main color.
In my opinion, there are no very bad people in "The World", there are only some selfish people who compete for their own interests.
Of course, there are many twists and turns in the process, and it is also sad, but the main tone is still warm.
This may also be my perspective of observing society, or a state that society should have—warmth is greater than cold, kindness is greater than evil, light is better than darkness, and it should also be the mainstream expression of film and television works.
The main tone of warmth, positivity, and good deeds is precisely the realism of China and the way of life of our generation of Chinese people.
If we don’t put these things in the foreground to summarize, on the contrary, the dramas we watch are all about intrigue in the workplace and intrigues in life. These become the main expressions of a society, which is a very strange phenomenon.
We have already lived a very hard life. There are pressures in work and challenges in life. We have to magnify some things that are not sunny or uplifting but lack value judgment for everyone to see. I don’t like it, I hate it.
Liberation Weekend: Are you also a warm person in your life?
Li Lu: I think I am a warm man.
Maybe it is because I have this characteristic that I can pay more attention to the warmth in human nature.
I always feel that the world I see is pretty good, I don't magnify joy, I only magnify warmth.
The social news that I see is still mostly good news. I never read that kind of lace news and curious stories. I just filter them out. I don’t want negative energy information to contaminate my brain.
Liberation Weekend: We interviewed Liang Xiaosheng, the original author of "The World of Humanity". The title of the article was "The Lesson of "Culture of Good People". Is "The World of Humanity" still the pursuit of "culture of good people"?
Li Lu: Of course, we advocated "five stresses and four beauties" before, and every year we learn from Comrade Lei Feng, and select the "moving China" person of the year, etc., all to establish the image of a good person and promote the emergence of "good person culture".
The "good person culture" is rooted in the works of Mr. Liang Xiaosheng.
Teacher Liang Xiaosheng and I have a lot in common, and the "good person culture" is the most important point, which determines the value of "The World".
There may be pain, hardships and misunderstandings in personal and social development, but we always believe in the existence of warmth, and always insist on the pursuit of "good people culture". This is the background of Chinese life.
"This show must be born at the right time"
Liberation Weekend: Trying to be warm, there will be less dramatic conflicts and less eye-catching. Are you worried about the ratings?
Li Lu: For the TV series I made myself, I am quite sure about the ratings.
Because I know what my show is going to convey and where its selling points are, these are all things that need to be estimated in advance.
I still have expectations for the psychological trend of the audience and the needs of people at the moment, so I think my several dramas are fairly accurate in their judgments.
Liberation Weekend: Indeed, whether it's "The Boss's Happiness", "The Name of the People", or "The World", you seem to have stepped on the exact node.
Li Lu: Yes, at this point, it flows naturally.
The actors' performances flow naturally, the director's work flows naturally, and the original works can flow naturally at this time, both smoothly and not deliberately.
When "The Boss's Happiness" was broadcast in 2010, people were calling for a slow life and to improve their sense of happiness; in 2017, "The Name of the People" became popular. At that time, anti-corruption and "fighting tigers and flies" were everyone's concern. topic.
Let's talk about "The World", it looks back on the warmth of the world in the past 40 or 50 years, the ups and downs of reform and opening up, and the achievements China has made today. Now, there is a lack of a TV series of this length and size.
I feel that this kind of thing is really needed, and it should come naturally.
The director must think closely about the times, and it must be "this drama should be born at the right time".
If you don't pay attention to society, current affairs, and the audience's thoughts, you won't resonate with the audience and won't "explode".
In fact, there is no good or bad subject matter, and each subject matter may arouse the nerves of the audience.
Simply put, be an observer, and more complexly, be a thinker.
Jiefang Weekend: Nowadays, there are still relatively few TV dramas that we pay attention to reality.
Li Lu: It's not the average number, but the special number, because many "realistic" dramas don't really pay attention to reality and have no roots.
At the "Human World" symposium held by the Chinese Writers Association not long ago, Zhang Hongsen, secretary of the Party Group of the Writers Association, said that in many TV dramas reflecting the current situation, the protagonists have no parents. In the thirty or forty episodes, no parents have ever called.
Without parents, do characters pop out of thin air?
Others say that only those who ruthlessly criticize reality are realist works.
In my opinion, criticizing alone is definitely not enough, nor simply copying it. The degree to which these points are appropriate is the embodiment of the creator's creative ability.
In terms of quantity, China's TV drama production ranks first in the world.
Our output is amazing, and there's a lot of good stuff in it.
But overall, quantity over quality, we have plateaus, but we need more peaks.
Among the works of realistic themes, there are fewer works that focus on workers, which is normal, because film and television is also an industry, and its attributes as a commodity are very important.
If no one invests, naturally it will not be able to shoot.
"The World" can be said to break this point.
The details of life are fluffy
Liberation Weekend: In "The World", you have carried out the ultimate aesthetic pursuit to the end, and made great efforts in all aspects from art, photography to costumes and props.
What do these sincere details mean to a work?
Li Lu: I have been telling our costume and props team that every prop and every costume in "The World" must tell stories and participate in performances.
We just want the audience to "dream back" to that era at a glance.
The crew built a 40,000-square-meter scene, 70,000 meters of light lines, and dozens of ultra-long box trucks.
The props library has more than 10,000 square meters, and those old objects are all collected by us.
The calendar behind the actor, there are different motorcycle girls every year, and the actor is quiet; the price of the electric fan and the style of the radio can not be wrong at all; Smoky over...these details of life are fluffy.
"The World" is about a kind of "patience", and how to accurately present the brand of the times is a arduous task.
Our team is like a careful old craftsman, bit by bit restoring the details of the Chinese people's "food and clothing costs" for half a century.
Liberation Weekend: There are also some period dramas, which are exquisite enough to make a drama.
Actors are concerned about the screen image and costumes that do not match the era, and some netizens even commented that this is a downgrade of screen consumption.
Li Lu: For a realistic work, it generally describes the people around us - ourselves, our parents, our brothers and sisters.
Authenticity, like ABC, is fundamental.
You see we have more than 100 characters in this show, one is one.
The "Six Little Gentlemen" can't be slapped in the face, and they have to look like real workers.
If you find a weak person to play it, it will not be credible at all. Unlike a worker, you can't do heavy work when you look at it.
Jiefang Weekend: Why do TV dramas that don’t look like they still exist, and why is there a market?
Li Lu: When capital entered the film and television industry, they all wanted to rapidly increase the volume and output.
How to produce high-quality products under such circumstances should be a difficult problem that must be overcome in the process of industrialization.
When this impetuous hustle and bustle has passed, and the hot money has receded, the capital that came in at this time has been rethought and treated as a sustainable industry.
Under the trend of globalization, we can see excellent film and television works from all over the world. At this time, if you want to come back to false, the common people will not accept it.
Now, we are gradually getting better, the quality of our works has been improved, we pay more attention to the actors' performance and artistic virtue, and the management of fans is also more standardized.
We need time, and everyone in this industry should think about which direction to go.
This "love" can transcend borders and cultures
Liberation Weekend: Recently, "Disney bought the copyright of "The World" to be broadcast in non-China regions" has become a hot search, and a foreign company famous for its animation has bought Chinese realism-themed film and television works. Did you surprise at that time? ?
Li Lu: I was also a little surprised, but then I thought it was reasonable.
I have spoken to the BBC (British Broadcasting Corporation) about content collaboration.
The BBC said frankly that the theme of Wu Zetian that they want to cooperate with us most, because they have a queen, and we also have one in our history.
They listed all the films and TV works related to Wu Zetian that were shot in China since 1949. They were very comprehensive and analyzed in great detail.
I find it very shocking that the homework they have done is so worthwhile for us to learn.
I have also heard that Disney is very strict when choosing works, and it chose us, which is enough to prove that this film and television giant is optimistic about the global spread of "The World".
In my opinion, cultural import and cultural export are equal.
Over the years, we have brought in many good movies, TV dramas, and music from the West, and it's time to show some of our good works to foreigners.
Jiefang Weekend: When you heard the news, "The World" had just started filming for a month. Will it affect the next filming?
Li Lu: It has a great influence on us. I hope that every scene, every line, every scene must have an international perspective, and we must think about how foreign audiences will see it.
I'm not afraid that the "light character film" is a little dirty and broken, but your lines, production, temperament and vision must be affordable and not shameful when you get it anywhere.
In every scene we shoot, we must remind everyone to let audiences at home and abroad see the real leap of China in the past 50 years.
This is a new pressure and motivation for the entire crew.
Liberation Weekend: There are also voices of doubt. Some people worry about whether foreigners can understand it. Others think it will be misunderstood, because after all, this play describes some of our miserable pasts.
Li Lu: I don't think it's a problem if I can understand it.
The joys and sorrows of mankind, the victory of justice over evil, and the call for a better life are all the same.
We also mentioned just now that the most prominent theme of "The World" is "love". This "love" has nothing to do with the background of the times, nationality, region, or race. It is hidden in the softest part of everyone's heart, which is also its "love". Empathy".
What Disney sees should be the power of "empathy". Such feelings can definitely transcend national boundaries and cultural differences. I have no worries about this.
In fact, many dramas depicting suffering in many countries have also been broadcast on Disney.
Moreover, the main content of our play is not the suffering itself, but more of the Chinese people's forbearance and strength, and the great success of China's reform and opening up.
Being able to show China to the world through vivid characters is a very good opportunity to let the world know more about China.
Liberation Weekend: As a director, do you also want to tell the story of our Chinese to the world?
Li Lu: Of course.
When "In the Name of the People" was broadcast before, some overseas Chinese and foreigners were watching, and even memorized the lines in it, indicating that they really liked it.
On the contrary, there is always a voice in our country that foreigners cannot understand our story.
You are not ready to let them see, how do you know they can't read it?
The world understands us far less than we understand the world, but if what we show the world is not a boutique, but some immature works, and others don’t agree with it, how can they really understand us?
Therefore, you must make good things that can reflect Chinese culture and real life in China, so that people feel that I want to watch and I like to watch, and also identify with your nation and your country in the process.
Through a TV series, a movie, through characters, through stories, and through bits and pieces in the play, the effect of moisturizing things will be achieved, which is also the meaning of "going to sea" for film and television works.
Read "The World"
Many people's Renyin Year of the Tiger started with the broadcast of the TV series "The World".
Some people think that literature and film and television are two distinct things. The hit of "The World" once again strongly proves the close relationship between literature and film and television. magnificent sight".
From literature to film and television, this is not only a description of a process, but also a broad space for vibrant creation and acceptance.
Literature and film and television are a relationship that distinguishes, inspires, inspires, complements each other, and ultimately strengthens and magnifies each other.
Looking back at the history of the development of literature and film and television since modern times, we can all deeply look forward to the power of film and television in the power of literature, and understand the power of literature in the power of film and television.
——Tie Ning, Chairman of China Writers Association and Chairman of China Federation of Literary and Art Circles
The creators of "The World" are successful.
They are willing to search for the inner essence in daily life, empathize with the hearts of every character, even the most hidden motives, and then use the original logic of the characters to vividly describe life and capture the voice of human nature, conveying the truth, goodness and beauty. underlying values.
The success of the TV series "The World" is a victory of life - if you respect life, life will give you infinite charm; it is also a victory of artistic creation - if you create with your heart, the audience will listen with your heart.
——Ren Zhonglun, Vice Chairman of China Film Association and Chairman of Shanghai Film Association
The film and television drama has done a good refinement of the thoughts I want to express.
The TV series of "The World" changed some characters and plots from conceptualization to concretization, and displayed them more intelligently. For example, for the portrayal of Zhou's mother, the plot of Zhou's father's approval of Zheng Juan was changed to let Zheng Juan listen at the door. From the heart-to-heart dialogue between the father and son, etc., these changes prove that the director and the adaptor have improved the original work.
If the novel can be rewritten, I would like to incorporate the wisdom of the creators.
——Liang Xiaosheng, the original author of "The World"
This is the hardest work I've ever done.
Serious literature is a personal reflection on life experiences, while TV dramas are popular art. The more serious literature is, the more difficult it will be to change it into a TV drama.
The transformation of novel expression into film and television expression is not only in form, but also in concept.
Film and television drama is a collective art. This drama has made the most correct balance between art and market. This is the best original work, director and film and television drama I have worked with.
What attracts me in the book is the author's main idea - to speak up for the people at the bottom of life.
The gist is correct.
These little people, even in turbulent times, have always been consistent and maintained a good background - what kind of spiritual attributes have the Chinese nation and the Chinese people had for thousands of years?
——Wang Hailing, screenwriter of "The World"
"The World" will tell you that home has never been a reasonable place.
In other TV dramas, usually two people quarrel, and 80% of the dramas will have a problem-solving link.
But this drama doesn't. After today's quarrel, reconciliation will take place tomorrow. It doesn't have the process of solving the problem.
But the audience is receptive because this is home.
Filming other films is filming, and filming this film is like living a short life, because in this world, it is hope and reconciliation, but also encounter and farewell.
——Lei Jiayin, actor of Zhou Bingkun in "The World"