After sixteen years in power, German Chancellor Merkel came to an end and Schultz officially took over.

Where does the Sino-German and Sino-European relationship in the "post-Merkel era" lead?

Sino-US relations have gone through ups and downs, how should Germany and Europe deal with it?

　　China News Agency "Ask East and West China Dialogue" recently invited Johanna Pratt, chairman of the Munich East Foundation and director of the Munich Confucius Institute, and Eberhard Sandschneider, a well-known German international relations scholar, and China News Agency Germany Peng Dawei, chief reporter of the branch and vice president of the China News Network Research Institute, started a dialogue on the above issues.

Sandschneider stated that accusing China in a gesticulating manner, or simply saying that China has not met Western expectations, is not a constructive way of handling relations with China.

He not only opposes sanctions, but also points out for "decoupling with China" that if any country is caught in a continuous confrontation with China, it will not serve its own interests and all parties will suffer from it.

　　Eberhard Sandschneider (Prof. Dr. Eberhard Sandschneider) is a well-known German international relations scholar and an expert on China.

Served as the director of the Institute of the German Diplomatic Association, the head of the Political Department of the Free University of Berlin, and an advisory member of the German Federal Institute for Security Policy.

Now he is an emeritus professor at the Free University of Berlin and a partner of the consulting company "Berlin Global Consultants".

Johanna Poellath (Johanna Poellath) is the chairman of the Munich Oriental Foundation and a council member of the Confucius Institute in Munich.

Data map: Schultz (left) and Merkel.

The following is an excerpt from the full text of the dialogue:

Peng Dawei: What do you think of Huntington's theory of clash of civilizations?

Sandschneider:

Harvard professor Graham Allison discussed the famous "Thucydides Trap" in his books published in recent years.

This is actually nothing new in global history.

The rise of China is actually a completely normal process. Just imagine that when a country has a population of 1.4 billion people and such a vast area, and the average annual economic growth rate reaches double digits in 40 years, then after 40 years, no one will You will be surprised at its transformation of economic power into political influence and military capabilities.

　　If any country is caught in a continuous confrontation with China, it will not serve its own interests, and we will all suffer from it.

The "magic" that began with Trump and was inherited by Biden is "decoupling," which means that the two largest economies in the world are disconnected from each other.

This approach will put German companies in an almost unresolvable "choice of two" dilemma-which market in China and the United States should they focus on?

Which market has to be alienated because of sanctions?

Therefore, how to properly handle relations with China is a question of the survival of German companies.

　　In recent days, when we consider what happened in Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, Syria and other places, where should we talk about the "value system" with China?

In these places, we tried to use force to implement the Western value system into politics, but ultimately ended in a disastrous defeat.

The regrettable result of these events is that, compared with China's criticism of the West, the West itself has caused much more damage to its own value system.

This is the trap of Western "value diplomacy", and our credibility is seriously damaged.

Peng Dawei: What do you think of the recent attempts by China and the United States to improve relations?

What does this mean for China-Germany and China-EU relations?

Sandschneider:

Dialogue itself is already very important, and it is very important to avoid military friction.

The confrontation between China and the United States has not disappeared, but the two sides have opened a dialogue. This is the first positive signal in a long time, so it is very important.

On October 28, 2021, the 400th German enterprise signed a contract and settled in Taicang, Jiangsu.

Photo courtesy of the Propaganda Department of Taicang Municipal Party Committee

Pratt: On the one hand, China is already a global economic power that Germany and Europe cannot bypass; on the other hand, the West has strong accusations against China on issues such as human rights and values.

How can Germany maintain a sound foreign policy in such a tense environment?

Sandschneider:

I will not make suggestions to China in a gesticulating way

.

I will not blindly say that "China has not done what we expect him to do." Instead, I will try to make suggestions for China’s policies and let China Being able to do it is more in line with self-interest.

　　The enlightenment that China can learn from the United States is that it should withstand some of the criticisms and at the same time respond to these criticisms in a constructive manner. As for the other criticisms, of course they must fight back when they should fight back.

But in general, accepting criticism is something a global power must get used to.

　　On the other hand, how should the West improve its China policy?

First of all, I have observed China for more than 40 years. Our biggest problem lies in anticipation management.

Some of my American colleagues have not changed their practices in 40 years.

And when they found that China hadn't "complyed", their response was of course anger and even some frustration.

Regardless of whether the West likes it or not, or thinks whether it has reached its expected value, it is a completely legitimate right for China to defend its own interests.

This means that anticipation management is a major challenge for the West in handling relations with China.

　　The second issue is the internal politicization of China policy.

When politicians criticize China for "violating human rights," "theft of technology," "market access," etc., it is easy to get a good applause in their country, but this has nothing to do with the content of their criticism.

We did not make efforts commensurate with the size of China to understand this vast country, which has resulted in the obvious arrogance that characterizes our discussions around China.

We believe that our value system and political system are also applicable to China, but China does not accept this set.

In the context of China's domestic politics, the arrogance of the West over the years is reminiscent of the humiliation suffered in history.

　　If you want to find a concept that can briefly summarize a multi-dimensional, rather than black and white China policy, I would like to quote the words of my respected former German ambassador to China, Michael Schäfer. He is right China has an extraordinary understanding-"Equal and respectful dialogue."

Apart from dialogue, there are no other options.

Are sanctions an alternative?

I cannot think of any of the sanctions imposed by the West against China for various reasons.

　　Germany and China will celebrate the 50th anniversary of the establishment of diplomatic relations next year.

In 1972, no one could imagine that the economic and political relations between Germany and China could reach the level of recent years.

Hope that ultimately comes from the goodwill of both parties and the willingness to learn from each other, so that we can successfully resolve difficult challenges.

Pratt: Why do many people in the West worry that "as China's global economic expansion will increase its political influence", how strong do you think this influence is?

Does Western democracy need to be "defended" now?

Sandschneider:

Democracy certainly needs to be defended, but you need to be more confident when defending it.

To illustrate this issue, the controversy surrounding the Confucius Institute is a good example.

It is said that China is trying to "impose a huge influence on Western society," and the Confucius Institute is one of the "submarines" to achieve this goal.

Is that true?

Well, it may be said, "The mission given to the Confucius Institute is to show a positive image of China to the world."

But is this unique to China?

Not really.

What is the Goethe-Institut in Germany doing?

What are the major political foundations in Germany doing?

What does the German development aid agency GIZ do?

　　A country tries to show its positive image as much as possible-this is the most normal practice in the world.

The United States did it, Europe did it, and China is doing it now.

We should not criticize China for this.

In the process, the doubters exposed their lack of confidence in the attractiveness of their own values.

Having said that, I want to return to Shi Mingxian's words that we must conduct a dialogue in a respectful way.

On the morning of the 8th local time, the German Bundestag formally elected Schultz, the candidate of the SPD Chancellor, as the new Chancellor of Germany.

Pratt: What do you think of Germany's foreign policy in the next few years?

Sandschneider:

From many perspectives, Germany's foreign policy is undoubtedly in a period of major changes.

The first is the changes in transatlantic relations. We have seen the latest trends in US foreign policy. Europe is no longer the core ally of the United States. Biden does not even ask Europe before making a decision-whether it is Paris or Berlin. This has brought a shocking effect to the foreign policies of Germany and the European Union.

Secondly, there is also confusion within the EU.

We have a foreign action department, but we lack a foreign policy; we have a high-level representative of EU foreign and security policy, but no one will truly claim that "the EU has a unified foreign policy."

Therefore, German foreign policy faces huge challenges.

　　China is a kind of meritocracy.

If an official cannot prove that he has the corresponding ability and experience, it is impossible to become the head of China's foreign affairs department.

In this regard, China is result-oriented.

In Germany, if a government meeting to form a cabinet catches up with the wrong time node or unsatisfactory situation, it is possible to introduce a foreign minister with no diplomatic experience.

Nothing like this will happen in China.

Such a thing will not benefit German foreign policy.