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WORLD:
Mr. Kelber, if you look at the past few months of fighting pandemics in Germany, some people get the impression that the federal and state governments are massively intervening in various civil rights - but they don't really dare to deal with data protection.
Why is that?
Ulrich Kelber:
If I still had hair now, I would tear it out.
Because the statement is not true.
There are massive restrictions on the normally applicable data protection rules.
The authorities collect data, evaluate data and forward data.
Just think of the digital immigration registration that travelers from risk areas have to fill out.
However, we have been fighting for months to ensure that the principles of data protection are retained in all the Corona measures.
Ulrich Kelber (SPD), Federal Commissioner for Data Protection: "If you wanted to make the Corona warning app mandatory, you would need a legal basis for it"
Source: picture alliance / dpa
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WELT:
Nevertheless: The German and also the European approach differs massively from that of other countries.
Asian countries weight rights differently: They collect more data, but people can move around more freely.
Is there no scope for this in Germany?
Kelber:
I do not think the discussion about this is productive.
South Korea, for example, accesses the data of credit card companies to monitor compliance with the quarantine of infected people.
Fortunately, we don't have this infrastructure in Germany.
Such a system would take a long time to build.
In addition to a legal basis, personnel would also be needed to evaluate this.
WORLD:
There are other examples too.
In Taiwan, compliance with the quarantine is also checked digitally.
At the beginning of the pandemic, the authorities checked which radio cell a cell phone had logged into.
Would that be feasible in this country?
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Kelber:
Counter-questions: Do we have a problem with monitoring the quarantine in Germany?
And do we know whether the falling number of infected people in Asia is due to surveillance?
I doubt that.
Possibly the development in Asia has to do with the discipline of the people there.
Almost all of them wear masks and adhere to measures.
The fight against the pandemic does not serve to combat the pandemic without speaking about such individual measures.
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WORLD:
Politicians in Germany have been criticizing for months that the quarantine is not adhered to by some people and that the health authorities lack the staff to check it.
So the question again: from the data protectionist's point of view, do you see scope for a digital review to force compliance, to relieve the authorities - and perhaps to give everyone else more freedom?
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Kelber:
If it's really such a big problem, then politicians have to put appropriate measures on the table.
As the Federal Data Protection Officer, I then check whether the measures comply with European law: Is it necessary to process additional data here?
Is there a transparent legal basis for this?
Are there more lenient means of achieving the goal?
To assert or demand anything in talk shows or comments is not enough.
WORLD:
There are other areas in which the Asian approach differs from ours: Health data is also transmitted directly digitally.
The body temperature, for example, so that health authorities can understand how the disease is progressing.
What speaks against it with us?
Kelber:
We don't fail because of data protection, but because of the digital infrastructure.
The Infection Protection Act allows the health authorities to process data from infected people in quarantine.
Unfortunately, we do this largely in analog form because digitization is not far enough.
WORLD:
Let's talk about the Corona warning app, which is once again criticized.
Bavaria's Prime Minister Markus Söder (CSU) said: "The Corona warning app could have a greater effect, ... but it basically fails because of a very high data protection hurdle." What do you say?
Kelber:
He didn't say that for the first time.
Every time I wait in vain for him to name a specific functionality that is technically feasible and that is said to have failed in Germany due to data protection concerns.
My authority has accompanied the Corona warning app from the start.
And first you have to say: There is no data protection reason not to install it.
You are making an important contribution to protecting your fellow human beings.
We are firmly convinced that you can add functions to the Corona warning app without experiencing data protection problems.
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WORLD:
Which do you mean?
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Kelber:
For example, automatic cluster detection could be integrated.
In addition, one could end the paperwork in the catering trade by integrating a corresponding registration option in the app.
People could then check into restaurants directly with the app and then be informed via the app if there were outbreaks.
I can imagine that users of the app will also voluntarily share negative test results in order to support pandemic research.
These are all functions that can be built in and implemented in compliance with data protection regulations.
WORLD:
Could people also be obliged to register digitally when they go to a restaurant, for example using the warning app?
Kelber:
If you wanted to make the Corona warning app mandatory, you would need a legal basis.
But I warn against such considerations.
That would assume that everyone has a reasonably up-to-date smartphone.
And that this smartphone is always charged and Bluetooth is activated.
How do you want to control something like that?
Something else is the obligation to register.
They already exist.
One could create digital solutions there.
WORLD:
The digital entry registration is similar: People who come from risk areas have to register digitally with their address data.
You have criticized parts of it.
Why?
Kelber:
We criticized a number of things that were debated in the development process of the digital entry registration.
It was very important to us that no health data had to be stored and that the deletion periods were aligned with the known infection periods.
It is not possible for the data to be with the authorities for months.
These suggestions were taken up, other criticisms of details remain.
WORLD:
The subject of vaccination will play a decisive role next year.
There will be no obligation, but a fairly precise documentation of which groups have already been vaccinated.
The government is planning a central vaccination registry.
How skeptical are you about the planning?
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Kelber:
I have no fundamental skepticism.
Such a register and the associated data processing need a legal basis.
This will be able to be designed in compliance with data protection regulations.
We will take a close look at what data is collected, whether the collection is necessary and with whom it is shared.
WORLD:
According to reports, non-personal information such as age, gender, place of residence and vaccination indication as well as the location of the vaccination, the date and the vaccine product with batch number should be recorded.
Doesn't that put you off?
Kelber:
No, not at all.
But right now it's all about the details.
The consultations are currently still taking place confidentially with the federal government.
We will only comment publicly when the federal government has decided on a course of action.
Hope rises - construction of the vaccination centers is in full swing
The pharmaceutical companies Moderna and Biontech applied for approval for their vaccines from the EU at almost the same time.
With a little luck, the first people could be vaccinated this year.
The construction of the vaccination centers is in full swing.
Source: WELT / Lea Freist
WORLD: It has
already been announced that some companies, such as airlines, want to see some kind of vaccination documentation before people get on.
How do you see it
Kelber:
That has to be discussed with the national data protection officer responsible for the airlines and the other European data protection supervisory authorities.
What is certain is that we will have to take another look at what the idea of such documentation is.
What about people who, for example, cannot have vaccinations due to previous illnesses?
Are they then excluded from promotion?
What legal basis do the companies rely on?
That is certainly not unproblematic.
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