Karpov willingly responded to the request for an interview on the occasion of the anniversary, but immediately warned:
- Unfortunately, only by phone - I have been in the hospital for two weeks.
I came to have a CT scan and return home, but failed to return: the doctors strongly recommended to stay and undergo an examination.
True, they promised to release them soon - just in time for the birthday
(the conversation took place in the middle of the week. - RT)
.
- What is your relationship with your own age, Anatoly Evgenievich?
- While free.
Maybe the reaction didn't get so fast on the chessboard.
But on the chessboard, again, less energy is spent.
In life, to be honest, I felt the age more strongly when I crossed the 50-year mark.
Now I don't feel it so sharply.
- Are you still on your side with chess?
- The last time I became world champion was in 1998, since then I have actually stopped fighting for this title.
But I take part in tournaments all the time.
- In other words, is chess still a source of income for you?
- To some extent, yes.
They just seem to run parallel to my main activity.
And the level is no longer the same to receive serious prizes.
- Outstanding athletes, like outstanding chess players, are probably, as a rule, inveterate egoists. I think you were no exception, especially during the period when you were fighting for the world crown and a huge number of people worked for you in one way or another. At what point did the thought come that it was time not only to receive, but also to give?
- I have never concentrated only on chess.
Besides, I have been engaged in social activities for a very long time, and this greatly erodes chess egoism.
The other day I celebrated the 60th anniversary of the organization, which I have been heading for almost four decades.
- Are you talking about the Peace Fund?
- Yes.
Quite recently we have returned the old name and are again called the Soviet Peace Fund.
- I know that many charitable foundations are now experiencing noticeable difficulties. Are you an exception in this regard?
- It really became difficult with finances.
In general, the entire system of charitable activities in Russia was destroyed by Alexander Yakovlev back in Soviet times.
He passed through the Politburo and the government a decision on the actual democratization of the stock movement.
Allowed "pocket" funds, and began a universal theft of money.
If earlier we collected funds, were accountable for them, everything was transparent, then Yakovlev practically removed this control.
And this very strongly violates our entire ideological space.
- What can make you personally donate money to a charitable foundation?
- Only the confidence that the money will reach the addressee.
When I became the head of the Peace Fund, we worked very hard and monitored all programs.
All targeted transfers to the Fund have always reached the goal.
We did not even leave any deductions for ourselves, neither for organizational activities, nor for administrative ones.
I have never received a salary from the Peace Fund, although in Soviet times we had billions on our account.
When the economic situation worsened in the last years of the existence of the Soviet Union, the chairmen of the republican funds still insisted that I pay myself a salary.
- So that they can do the same?
- Well yes.
After all, they did not have such income as I did, and people simply could not afford to work on a voluntary basis.
And they could not set a salary for themselves, since even the chairman of the Peace Fund does not have this salary.
Therefore, by the decision of the Board, I was assigned the official content, but I immediately wrote a statement that I was redirecting this money to the Peace Fund.
And I never received a single kopeck from the Fund.
- Does big money require a lot of attention to itself?
- If a person is concerned about this, then yes.
I would like not only to preserve, but also to increase.
But somehow I never really did it.
It was important for me that neither I nor my environment was in need.
We didn’t think where to get money for rent or other expenses.
Organize the same rest.
Here, this is the main thing.
- You're not dissembling?
- Not at all.
I have a friend in America, a very wealthy man.
At the beginning of his career he was a grandmaster, then he took up gambling and traded options.
And once he told me: you know, my standard of living will not change if I have 10 million dollars, five or 20. I won't eat 10 dinners in one sitting?
So the main thing in matters of finance is not to lose what is.
- Playing on the stock exchange, can you calculate the process several moves ahead? Or is it not chess?
- I think no.
I tried it several times, I lost everything.
Since then, I don't trust agents.
I believe that their relationship with clients is initially dishonest.
In my opinion, agents should take their percentage of income, from the profit they provide.
And they take money in all cases, even if they lost all your fortune.
Moreover, even if they win something later, they will not compensate you for any previous losses.
If you are to play on the stock exchange, you have to do it yourself.
Study, get into the topic, make decisions.
And this is a separate profession.
- In one of the interviews, where you were traditionally asked about relations with Kasparov, about other chess confrontations and conflicts, you answered that time smooths out a lot. Is there something left that still hasn't been smoothed out?
- Yes of course.
History is not forgotten.
The sensations are simply dulled.
But what happened happened.
To the gallery page
- Are there any regrets about this?
- Yes, I have no time to think about it.
I am such a busy person, I have so many plans and specific programs that ... Unless, when I write books, I remember something.
- How many books have already been written?
- More than a hundred.
I made one of the books with the Disney company, for the kids.
In Russian it sounded like "Learn to Chess".
In general, this book set a record - it was translated into 26 languages.
* * *
- In what direction, in your opinion, is chess developing now? And do they develop at all?
- Well, they develop, of course, the theory has always evolved.
There is a reassessment of some opening systems, because computers began to count deep enough.
At one time, I remember, the chess matches Moscow - St. Petersburg, then Leningrad, stopped, due to the fact that they did not have time to finish one game and with a score of 39.5 - 39.5 a draw was awarded.
Leningraders did not agree with that decision, since they had a won position.
An elementary queen endgame with a knight pawn.
It is only now that computers have proven that the award was wrong.
And then Leningraders simply stopped playing with Muscovites in protest.
- Was it a big loss for chess?
- Well, in general, yes.
- How can you explain that there are no longer really long careers in Russian chess?
- The fall of our sport began under Gorbachev, when all systems began to collapse, including sports ones.
I analyzed a lot of that period, both as an economist and as a public figure.
This is our stupid habit of carrying out reforms where they don't need to be carried out, and destroying everything to the ground, and then trying to create something ...
The Russian chess school was simply destroyed in those years, like many other things.
We have lost two generations of players, and most importantly, we have lost the connection between generations.
With the coaches, problems began to arise that had never happened before.
Accordingly, we have lost our dominance in the chess world.
I used to be on friendly terms with Samaranch, we once had lunch with him and discussed the possibility of including chess in the program of the Olympic Games.
Did you really think it could be real?
- Then the entire leadership of the IOC was essentially ready to prescribe in the Olympic Charter the inclusion of intellectual sports in the program of the Winter Olympics. The Summer Games were already overloaded with disciplines, but the Winter Games program allowed for some expansion. We discussed all this with Samaranch. Interestingly, Juan Antonio did not know that the oldest world title was in chess. The first match for the world championship in our sport was held 10 years before the modern Olympic Games - in 1886. Then even national championships in sports were not held. Wilhelm Steinitz became the first world champion, and I became 12th. For 100 years. And he was in this status at the time of our conversation for ten years. When I said this, Samaranch looked at me in surprise and said: “You are there in chess as the President of the IOC, or something,are you sitting? " I replied: "We are not sitting, we are fighting ..."
- And yet, why are even very strong players leaving chess so early now? Are there any other interests?
- Chess is constantly in a fever, then we run in one direction, then in the other.
And when there is no clear schedule, it is very difficult to build a preparation process.
Unfortunately, the FIDE leadership has been unprofessional for too long.
Campomanes was perhaps the last one who understood chess deeply enough.
Ilyumzhinov, on the other hand, sincerely believed that the main thing was to find money.
And the chess players will immediately come running and sit down to play at least a match for the world championship, at least any other tournament.
- It seems to me that the point is that Ilyumzhinov looked at chess, first of all, as an opportunity to build a business.
- He did not build any business.
The question is different.
The fact that Ilyumzhinov, having come to FIDE, seriously believed that he would be in chess, like Samaranch in the IOC.
That will command the chess players, the champions.
And when he saw that the title of world chess champion is much more prestigious in importance than the post of president of the federation, he began to destroy this prestige.
And he succeeded in this.
* * *
- Have you ever worked in the coaching staffs of other chess players?
- No, I was not a coach.
This is a separate profession.
Although I consulted individual players.
- And if Magnus Carlsen asked for help, would you agree?
- Not.
I just don't have time for this.
- Is social and political work more interesting for you than the chance, in a certain sense, to return to your own youth?
- I have too wide a range of interests to sacrifice them for the sake of working with one person.
I don’t want to be isolated.
Although I like Carlsen.
He is a very strong chess player, he plays in the same way and in the style in which I played myself.
That is, it is very reliable, using a small advantage.
Magnus is confident in himself, he knows how to fight to the end.
In other words, he has many positive qualities.
And it is no coincidence that he has been holding the world title for quite a long time.
- Do you think he will stay at this height for a long time?
- If he does not lose his head, then he will hold out for some time.
I think Ian Nepomniachtchi has a chance to overthrow the Norwegian, but he is emotionally unstable.
And for a world championship match, this is one of the key provisions.
The human system must be stable and strong.
- Which, by the way, is more important, a good memory or a strong nervous system?
- Memory is needed, of course.
But it is not a required attribute.
- How, then, to play at all, if there is no memory?
- There is an understanding of the game, intuition, certain knowledge.
Everything matters together.
Of course, we hold more information in our heads than an ordinary person.
But this is not the main advantage of a chess player.
- Is a professional chess player in the family a very difficult friend?
- Well, if the family is reasonable, then, probably, we are not the most difficult case.
If the family does not understand the degree of overload, they require attention, an internal conflict always arises.
Because when you play a world championship match, everything is focused on one task - to ensure the victory.
- Of those games that you played in your chess life, is there one that still stands before your eyes?
- I played the most games with beauty prizes.
So there are a lot of them.
There are, of course, special achievements - games that have entered the top ten in the history of chess.
But also not one, but three or four.
There are brilliant combinations, there are amazing positional ones, there are classic endgames.
Creatively, I achieved everything I wanted in chess.
Played 11 World Championship matches.
This is also a record in the history of chess.
And each in its own way was heavy.
- Is it true that one day you passed out from the stress?
- Not.
It never happened.
Although chess requires colossal energy consumption.
The Belgians once conducted a study and came to the conclusion that in terms of energy expenditure, chess is comparable to any other sport.
* * *
- You once said that boxers play chess very well, but I thought: does this mean that there are some similar mechanisms in boxing and chess?
- I think that a boxer's brain activity is close to that of a chess player.
And there, and there, there should be a clear instant reaction, in boxing even faster than at the board.
- As the multiple world champion Yevgeny Makarenko once joked, the head was given to the boxer so that they would not be hit in the face.
- That's right.
Perhaps that is why chess is popular among boxers.
Unlike, say, weightlifting.
- Or football.
- Or football.
Although in vain.
In football, it is certainly important to have a strong hit.
But you also have to see the field.
To understand where a pass can come from, to be able to give it yourself, to see everyone side by side, and at the same time not to lose speed.
In this regard, chess develops brain speed very strongly.
- Is it possible to change something in modern chess so that it does not lose in popularity to poker?
- Poker, we must pay tribute to him, very cleverly led the information and advertising policy.
Well, and then, those games where the role of chance is more significant will always be more attractive to the general public.
This is a purely American story.
That anyone can grab the bird of happiness by the tail.
In chess, no one can grasp it.
To become a world champion you need to work hard, you need talent.
Therefore, chess initially loses in this duel.
It is already difficult to restore the strict system of the World Championship, as it was before: the bulk is against the strongest always winning.
- As far as I remember, you always played great billiards. Have you ever made money this way?
- I do not like to play for money, neither billiards, nor cards, although I play cards well too.
In this respect, I am a gambling person, I like to win.
But I gamble for money only if people do not want to sit down at the table under no other conditions.
There are those who cannot play without money at all.
They cease to control themselves, the logic of the game is lost, and the process itself becomes uninteresting for a person.
I do not have it.
In addition, I play with friends, in familiar companies, and monetary settlements, even if people pretend that it does not matter to them, still affect the relationship in one way or another.
And I don't want to ruin my relationship with my friends.
* * *
- Has the pandemic greatly reduced your activity?
- Activity - no, but communication and the ability to move around the world - yes.
For example, two years ago I should have opened my chess school in Athens, in the very center of the city.
Then he was going to open a similar school in Tunisia.
But now you can't get there.
- Do you somehow control the process when opening a school abroad?
- I have a Karpov chess school, and all educational institutions that I open are participants in my movement.
Unfortunately, now there is still no unified competition system for the students of my schools.
But I want and plan to build one so that my schools in various countries would be more closely connected.
- Is your family jealous of chess, travel, schools, constant absences?
- Probably there is.
But they somehow got used to it already.
Still, chess has always occupied a special place in my life.
- Do you feel guilty about this at least sometimes?
- What to do if life turned out like that?
It is clear that loved ones put up with this.
Although I look at my daughter and often think that maybe she became, despite her young age, so intelligent and independent because she grew up in such an environment?
- Did you regret that the children did not follow in your footsteps?
- Not.
Chess is not a guaranteed profession, that's the whole problem.
In science, you became an academician - and in this title you can continue to live securely and continue to be realized.
And in chess, only regular victories bring income.
Even if you are a world champion, but you stopped winning competitions, this is only a historical memory, and historical merits.
- Would you change your titles, awards and titles if it could help humanity to solve some global issue or problem?
- I am not engaged in exchange.
Everything that I won is a gift to me, I think so.
Even from his collection of stamps he never gave anything away.
And I won't give it up, even if they offer me a good price.
Unless the exhibit will lose its importance for me.
* * *
- Who would you like to be remembered as a chess player or a public figure?
- What I have been observing for decades, my chess successes and chess fame close the achievements in all other areas.
My work in the field of ecology, social activities, and even building a system of schools around the world.
This is a tremendous job.
But whoever you ask will hear: Karpov?
Well, yes, a chess player.
We all know about him ... You don’t know anything about me!
- I’ll ask a question that is constantly being asked: why does the State Duma need athletes? What, relatively speaking, can they give to our society?
- Let's start with the fact that sport is the ability to take a responsible attitude to the assigned work, the ability to defend one's position, to be independent. Athletes play a very active role in parliamentary activities and do a lot. I, for example, led the law on solid household waste, the law on the disposal of tires. I managed to achieve the adoption of a decision by the government of Russia and the Krasnodar Territory, and to ban all landfills on the Black Sea coast. In practice, we thus protected the ecology of the Black Sea and the coast. At my suggestion, they began to open public receptions at environmentally hazardous enterprises in order to increase the level of trust and get timely access to information. Only in Tyumen have I opened four such reception rooms. In this city, we are conducting a rather unique environmental program, which has never happened in Russia.
- Just right to open the heading: "Few know, but I ..."
- Indeed, few people know, but I, for example, saved amateur fishing in Russia, although I never spoke about it anywhere either.
I worked as the first deputy chairman of the Committee on Natural Resources, and in the subcommittee on fisheries, which was supervised by me and the chairman of the subcommittee on water resources Elmira Glubokovskaya, a stupid idea arose to make all amateur fishing paid, under a license.
So the fishermen of Russia do not even suspect that only two people saved their hobby.
- Are you a fisherman yourself?
— Бывает, да, рыбачу. Но дело не в этом. А в том, что Россия испокон веков имеет свои традиции. У нас большие пространства. Периодически нам пытаются навязать стандарты альпийских стран. Ограничить сбор лесных ягод, грибов. А это неправильно, не говоря уже о том, что противоречит природе русского человека. Нельзя такие вещи предлагать. Я считаю, что это просто аморально.
— Какой недостаток вы не сумели в себе изжить? И есть ли он у вас?
— Ну, я бы не сказал, что это не недостаток. Очень часто люди принимают мою доброту за слабость. Что если я кого-то не наказал, не среагировал, значит, не проявил характер. И не понимают того, что я просто не хотел реагировать, не посчитал нужным.
— Как вы представляете следующие 10 лет своей жизни? Нет желания уйти на покой, сесть на даче в качалку, начать раскачиваться?
— Вот, этим я никогда точно не хотел заняться. Вообще не умею отдыхать. Возможно, это основная проблема моей жизни.