Editor's note:

The report of the 20th National Congress of the Communist Party of China pointed out that the excellent traditional Chinese culture has a long history, is broad and profound, and is the crystallization of the wisdom of Chinese civilization, which contains the world for the public, the people for the state, the government with virtue, the reform of the old and the new, meritocracy, the unity of heaven and man, self-improvement, virtuousness, faith, harmony, kindness and kindness to neighbors, etc., which are important embodiments of the cosmology, tianxia, society, and morality accumulated by the Chinese people in their long-term production and life, and are highly compatible with the values and propositions of scientific socialism.

The Chinese's "cosmology, world view, social view, and moral view" reflect the long history and humanistic heritage of Chinese civilization, and are an important dimension for the world to understand China, the Chinese people, the Communist Party of China, and the Chinese nation. The "East-West Question" column of China News Service specially launched a series of plans to interpret the meaning and influence of the "four views".

Beijing, 5 May (ZXS) -- Why do Chinese and Western "cosmological views" collide and learn from each other?

——Interview with Mei Qianli, a French sinologist and professor of the Department of Philosophy of Sun Yat-sen University

Written by Xueying Xu

The excellent traditional Chinese culture has a long history and is broad and profound, which is the crystallization of the wisdom of Chinese civilization and an important embodiment of the Chinese people's cosmology, world view, social view and moral view. The cosmology represented by the "unity of heaven and man", as Mencius said, "the upper and lower flows with heaven and earth", is the epistemology of the Chinese people on the universe for thousands of years, and it is also the methodology for Chinese people's life and livelihood.

Mei Qianli, a French sinologist and professor of the Department of Philosophy of Sun Yat-sen University, and deputy director of the Archives of Western Studies and Eastern Studies, pointed out in a recent interview with the "East-West Question" of the China News Agency that there is a lot of room for dialogue between the traditional Chinese cosmology and the Western-based cosmology, and the basic problem lies in how to understand the relationship between one and many. The Chinese cosmology, which emphasizes the unity of heaven and man, focuses on how to divide under "unity", while the Western cosmology, which advocates that "God and man are fundamentally different", is committed to studying how to unify under "difference". Today, when the world is facing threats such as climate warming and the proliferation of nuclear weapons, the profound philosophy contained in the Chinese and Western cosmology inspires mankind to go beyond narrow vision, set aside short-term interests, and work together to face the future of mankind.

The following is a summary of the interview:

China News Agency: You have conducted extensive and profound research on Chinese philosophy, in your opinion, what cosmology is contained in the excellent traditional Chinese culture?

Mei Qianli: Westerners tend to understand Chinese philosophy as Confucian ethics represented by the "Three Principles and Five Permanents" and tend to evaluate it as a repressive ethic, especially for women. But then, it's easy to overlook the unique cosmology of Chinese philosophy, in which people actually have a huge space and are free to move freely in the infinite expanse.

From a philosophical point of view, China's cosmology originated from the I Ching, and after a long process in the pre-Qin and Han dynasties, it formed a more systematic philosophical discourse in the Confucian doctrine of the Song Dynasty. Interpersonal ethical relationships are placed in the wider natural world and connected to the changing seasons, celestial changes, etc.

In the 16th century, Western missionaries believed that the four-element theory (earth, water, air, and fire) derived from ancient Greece was truly scientific, and used this to negate the traditional Chinese concept of the "five elements" (gold, wood, water, fire and earth). However, from the perspective of modern science, whether it is the four natural elements or the "five elements", in fact, there is no scientific basis. The value of traditional Chinese cosmology lies in its observation of the connections between all things and the symbolic system they form from a macroscopic perspective, so that people can obtain personal positioning and self-knowledge in this system.

The exhibits exhibited at the annual special exhibition "Hehe China" of the Liaoning Provincial Museum are noted by the Ming Dynasty I Ching. Photo by Huang Jinkun

China News Agency: What are the differences or commonalities between the cosmology represented by the "unity of heaven and man" in traditional Chinese culture and the Western cosmology?

Mei Qianli: The "unity of heaven and man" in Chinese thought is a premise that does not need to be demonstrated, and on this basis, we can further discuss that heaven and man have different duties and obligations. In contrast, Western thought is premised on the belief that God is fundamentally different from man, and that God is the master of man. Therefore, man must respect God's sovereign and transcendent nature. If a person offends God, he is the greatest sin. Under the premise that God and man are fundamentally different, Western philosophers and theologians are committed to exploring the various ways in which man and God have established a relationship, so that the possibility of understanding arises between the two, and thus enables man to follow God's will in action, and even to eventually become one with God.

From this point of view, the Chinese cosmology, which emphasizes the "unity of heaven and man", focuses on how to divide under "unity", while the Western cosmology, which advocates that "God and man are fundamentally different", focuses on how to unify under "difference". The two orientations seem opposite, but the basic problem is the same, that is, how to understand the relationship between one and many. Even if the Chinese cosmology focuses on one, and the Western cosmology focuses on many, it is only a difference in path, not a fundamental difference.

In June 2022, a drone formation performance was held in Wujiangzhai Scenic Area, Banzhou District, Zunyi City, Guizhou Province. Photo by Qu Honglun

China News Agency: You pointed out that there is a lot of room for dialogue between Aristotle's metaphysical creation and China's traditional cosmology. Could you please elaborate further on this point?

Mei Qianli: First of all, we must distinguish between temporal and metaphysical creationism.

Due to the influence of the biblical book of Genesis, temporal creationism played a leading role in the West, and its core and focus was to clearly divide the creator and creation, establishing the distance between God and man, and we can see that the entire biblical narrative is devoted to how man crossed this distance and eventually became one with God.

However, Aquinas, the representative of scholasticism, established another creationism, metaphysical creationism, on top of Aristotle's philosophy. According to his view, it is not necessary to philosophically assume that God created the universe one day, but to understand the relationship between God and the universe as a timeless metaphysical relationship, that is, the entire universe, along with all things, exists directly dependent on God. In other words, God is the foundation of all things, not only creating them, but also keeping them alive at every moment, in layman's terms, continuing. This kind of thinking is closer to the traditional Chinese cosmology, which affirms the state of harmony first, and then proceeds from the highest principle of creation to separation.

China News Agency: The publication of Huanyou Interpretation in 1628 can be seen as a collision between Song Ming's theory and scholasticism. In your opinion, as a translation of Aristotle's commentary on the Heavens, how does the Huanyou Interpretation reflect the convergence of Western cosmology with traditional Chinese cosmology?

Mei Qianli: Missionaries to China in the late Ming Dynasty mainly introduced temporal creationism, which they believed was the core part of Western thought, showing the characteristics of Christianity, and could make up for the lack of relevant content in Chinese thought. However, Chinese at the time were less receptive to the idea that there was an absolute gulf between the creator and the creature.

In 1628, the Portuguese Jesuit Fu Fanji and the Chinese scholar Li Zhizao compiled and published the Huanyou Interpretation in Hangzhou, in an attempt to reconcile Aquinas's metaphysical cosmology with the cosmology of Song Mingli. The book details the metaphysical structure of the universe, affirming the materiality of everything on the one hand; On the other hand, it affirms that every object has its own essence and can ultimately be traced back to the highest essence, which is God. The God here cannot be completely equated with the God of Genesis, but primarily the God of philosophy. Although the Interpretation of Huanyou does not mention Song Ru's "Tai Chi", this metaphysical creation theory can also show that God, as the metaphysical basis of all things, is very similar to Song Ru's "Tai Chi".

It is a pity that no one has continued to explore this convergence since the publication of "Universal Interpretation". In his 1711 book Chinese Philosophy, the Belgian Jesuit Francis directly affirmed the Song Confucian concept of "Tai Chi" for the first time.

Taijitian, Yuyuan Ancient Village, Wuyi County, Jinhua City, Zhejiang Province. Photo by Zhang Jiancheng

China News Agency: From the perspectives of physical relations, ethical order, and the origin of the universe, what is the modern significance of the Chinese and Western cosmology?

Mei Qianli: First of all, let's look at the physical relationship between Chinese and Western cosmology. The superiority of the Chinese cosmology is more easily seen today, as is pre-Socratic natural philosophy, both of which emphasize the overall continuity of the universe. However, Aristotle "wrongly" divided the upper and lower moons, arguing that there is an eternal and unchanging "aether" on the moon, and four completely different natural elements (earth, water, air, and fire) under the moon, which truncates the material continuity of the universe.

Until the 16th century, Aristotle's ideas dominated the Western view of the universe. Later, thanks to Galileo's astronomical discoveries and Newton's law of gravitation, the Western cosmology re-accepted the continuity of matter in the universe. Although the Arya theory is obviously deficient and conjecture, it has the insight to oppose the view of the Earth as a closed unit, at the center of a network of interacting relationships. Modern astrochemistry somewhat affirms the Arsh view that the origin and evolution of the Earth must be understood from a macroscopic perspective of the entire universe.

Second, in terms of ethical order, Aristotle argued in On Heaven that the universe operates in a harmonious state in which there is no force or violence. In other words, the completeness of the universe is equivalent to ethical values, and the relations in the universe are not only physical, but also have a certain ethical dimension. When explaining the relevant content, in addition to quoting the "Zhou Yi Yi Yi Guan" "Heaven gives birth to the earth, its benefits are not enough" to explain, it also understands people as a small universe (microcosmos, or "small world" as Li Zhizao puts it), reflecting the humanist spirit of the Renaissance, not only explaining that man is in the universe, but also emphasizing that the universe is in man.

Finally, regarding the origin of the universe, Yash does not specifically discuss it in On Heaven, but provides a metaphysical basis for the universe in Metaphysics. Based on this, Aquinas points out that God and all things share "existence." The Interpretation of the Universal Existence translates this concept as "being" in order to show that the common basis of "all things" and "universal beings" lies in God's "beginning" and "wonderful beings". The emphasis on the concept of "being" in the Huanyou Interpretation allows Christian creationism to converge with Chinese thought.

Today, mankind faces great risks and challenges, such as global warming and the proliferation of nuclear weapons, all of which stem from mankind's failure to place itself in the universe and consider the relationship between man and the universe in a holistic way. In this regard, the traditional Chinese and Western cosmology is enlightening. Only by realizing that humanity depends on the entire universe can we move beyond narrow vision, set aside short-term interests, and work together to face humanity's future. (End)

Respondent Profile:

Thierry Meynard, French, born in 1963, is a professor and doctoral supervisor of the Department of Philosophy of Sun Yat-sen University, and the deputy director of the Archives of Western Studies and Eastern Studies of Sun Yat-sen University. He received his Ph.D. in Chinese Philosophy from Peking University in 2003. From 2004 to 2006, he was a lecturer at Fiedham University in New York City. In 2006, he joined the Macau Phisley Society. His research focuses on the exchange of Chinese and Western thought, Western classical philosophy, and contemporary neo-Confucianism, and has published more than 10 monographs in Chinese and English, and more than 40 papers in domestic and foreign journals.