China News Agency, Nanchang, December 21st, title: How does the English version of "Tang Xian's Ancestral Biography" allow the world to understand the humanistic China behind the drama?

  ——Interview with Zhu Hong, professor of Nanchang University, and Alan McFarlane, professor of social anthropology at Cambridge University

  China News Agency reporter Jiang Tao

  As a world literary giant and dramatist as famous as Shakespeare and Cervantes, Tang Xianzu's masterpiece "Linchuan Four Dreams" has an important position in the history of Chinese and even world literature.

Entering dreams with love and expressing feelings through dreams, his dream life is not only the pursuit and yearning for the ultimate love, the ultimate truth, the ultimate good, and the ultimate beauty, but also reflects the common eternal pursuit of human society.

  Zhu Hong, the author of the English version of "Tang Xian's Ancestral Biography", a professor at Nanchang University, and the president of the Jiangxi Provincial Culture and Tourism Research Promotion Association, and Alan McFarlane, the author of the preface to the book and a professor of social anthropology at the University of Cambridge, recently accepted an interview with China News Agency In an exclusive interview with "East and West", they share their views on Tang Xianzu's literary achievements and historical influence, as well as his role in promoting exchanges and mutual learning between Chinese and foreign civilizations.

The interview transcript is summarized as follows:

China News Agency reporter: "Tang Xianzu Biography" (English version) is the world's first full-English biographical translation that records the life and achievements of Tang Xianzu, a great Chinese literary figure. What is the content framework and original intention of the translation?

Alan McFarlane:

"Tang Xianzu Biography" (English version) is a translation based on Professor Zhu Hong's book "Tang Xianzu in Love in Dreams".

The author adopts a linear narrative method, recording Tang Xianzu's early childhood life, family background, education experience in his hometown Linchuan, Jiangxi Province, his rough and long career as an official with ups and downs in the middle period, and his resignation and return to his hometown in the later period. The whole process of creative life, coupled with the in-depth analysis of Tang Xianzu and his works, presents to readers the image of an art master who is upright, open-minded, sincere and full of romantic spirit.

English version of "Tang Xianzu" cover.

  Tang Xianzu's works and related deeds have not spread to the Western public until recent years. Before that, foreigners who knew his works were mainly scholars engaged in Chinese studies.

Translating and publishing "Tang Xian Zuzhuan", a biography that describes his life and biography in detail, has increased the understanding of the original author of the play and the historical and cultural background of the time for the majority of foreign readers.

In addition, unlike most biographies that monotonously narrate life history, this book also has certain value in academic aspects, and can be used as a reference for overseas experts and scholars in the fields of history, anthropology, art history, etc., and is conducive to deeper research.

China News Agency reporter: Tang Xianzu's achievements are far more than drama, but also in his philosophical thinking, humanistic care and personality spirit.

Why do you think Tang Xianzu became a banner of Chinese culture?

What spiritual connotation makes it transcend time and space and still glow with endless vitality?

Zhu Hong:

Tang Xianzu's "Four Dreams of Linchuan" entered dreams with love and expressed his feelings through dreams. He put his life sighs, career perceptions, and spiritual dreams into writing, fully expressing his aspirations for social fairness, righteousness in the world, freedom of love, and happiness in marriage. Pursuit and yearning.

These are the common pursuit and eternal yearning of human society, and conform to the common value orientation of Chinese and Western cultures in different periods.

Because of this, under the sky of human civilization, Tang Xianzu's people and writings have been able to shine for thousands of years—whether in the East or the West, in ancient times or in the present.

To this day, there are still many shining things in Tang Xianzu's body that are worth discovering and commemorating.

Linchuan version of Tang Xianzu's portrait.

Zhong Xinshe

  Paying attention to human feelings and respecting human nature are the cultural values ​​most admired and recognized by later generations in Tang Xianzu's spiritual world.

Fundamentally speaking, the development of literature is synchronized with human nature; the more a work reflects human nature, the more it can connect with readers' emotions.

After all, Tang Xianzu wrote "Four Dreams of Linchuan" with painstaking efforts, with the intention of saving the world with opera and understanding people with his true feelings.

It is his recognition of the ultimate love, the ultimate truth, the ultimate goodness, and the ultimate beauty, the pursuit of an ideal society, and the affirmation of human self-worth that make Tang Xianzu's works reflect ideological exploration and humanistic care that transcend time and space. generate contemporary meaning.

  At the same time, unlike Shakespeare's pure love for drama, Tang Xianzu's early ideals were Confucian-style political ambitions of governing the country and the world.

After that, despite the ups and downs in his official career, he still remained patriotic and caring for the people. He always had a sense of mission as an intellectual and worked hard to practice his ideals in the oppressive and cramped environment of the times.

The world is warm and cold, love is in dreams, Tang Xianzu has never gone to nothingness.

The "supreme love" he advocated by later generations is by no means indulging in individual and ego "only love", but embodies social and self-humane care.

Musical "Tang Xianzu".

Photo by Liu Zhankun

China News Agency reporter: There are many translations of Shakespeare's works in China, but there are relatively few translations of Tang Xianzu's works in the UK.

What do you think this work can do to promote English readers around the world to understand Chinese history and culture, and to build a bridge of cultural exchanges between China and foreign countries?

Zhu Hong:

In 2016, China and the UK jointly held a series of activities to commemorate the 400th anniversary of the death of Tang Xianzu and Shakespeare, which can be said to have set off a wave of "Tang Xianzu fever".

In April 2019, the first overseas Peony Pavilion was completed in Stratford, England, the hometown of Shakespeare; in September, the Peony Pavilion in Perm, Russia was completed.

The Peony Pavilion is known as an iconic symbol of Tang Xianzu's opera culture.

In 2016, the "Hometown of Tang Xianzu" Fuzhou City, Jiangxi Province held a visit to the tomb of Tang Xianzu.

A total of more than 300 people, including experts and scholars of soup science at home and abroad, representatives of foreign guests from the hometown of Shakespeare in the UK and the hometown of Cervantes in Spain, paid homage to Tang Xianzu's tomb and presented flowers.

Photo by Liu Zhankun

  But we should admit that currently Tang Xianzu is not as influential as Shakespeare in the world, and "Linchuan Four Dreams" has not been widely disseminated like Shakespeare's works.

Just as there are many translations of Shakespeare's works in China, there are still too few translations of Tang Xianzu's works in Britain.

  I hope that through the publication of "Tang Xianzu Biography" (English version), on the one hand, more foreign friends can understand Tang Xianzu, and at the same time understand Chinese history and Chinese culture.

On the other hand, it can play a role in attracting jade, promote the translation and publication of more Tang Xianzu's works and more Jiangxi cultural works abroad, and make greater contributions to promoting exchanges between Chinese and foreign civilizations.

Alan McFarlane:

Publication is still one of the effective ways in in-depth cross-cultural communication.

It is very important to choose high-quality books for planning, editing, translation and publishing in order for foreigners to have an in-depth understanding of Chinese thought, culture and history.

A few years ago, my colleagues and I co-founded Cambridge River Press in the UK, aiming to build a bridge for cultural exchanges between China and the West.

We have cooperated with China Commercial Press, China Science and Technology Press and other publishing institutions on many book publishing projects.

  We translate Chinese books into English, or translate English books into Chinese, introduce interesting and meaningful Chinese ideas to overseas, and bring the essence of foreign ideas to China.

We hope that through a multi-level cooperation model, we can truly realize exchanges and mutual learning among different civilizations.

  The depth and breadth of Chinese understanding of Shakespeare's literary works is far greater than that of the British for traditional Chinese literature.

"Tang Xianzu's Biography" (English version) has included Tang Xianzu's literary achievements and social life in his historical era in a multi-level and multi-dimensional manner while compiling the narrative.

This allows English readers around the world to understand Chinese literature and local culture in a more complete way.

  The publication project has also aroused the interest of researchers, writers and artists in many related fields in the West in the study of traditional Chinese drama, thus actively promoting the exchanges in literature, drama and music between China and the UK.

China News Agency reporter: Tang Xianzu’s hometown, Fuzhou, Jiangxi Province, proposed the cultural IP of “Oriental Shakespeare” in 2017. Through the International Theater Festival, cultural exchanges with Britain, Spain, Italy and other countries have become the norm.

What is the significance of extensive participation in the dialogue of world civilizations?

Zhu Hong:

Our literature and art can only shape Chinese models, cast Chinese spirit and create high-quality masterpieces only if we look up to the bright starry sky of human civilization, and at the same time set foot on the land of China and take root in the excellent traditional Chinese culture.

  It should be said that by carrying out multi-channel, multi-form and multi-level foreign literary and artistic exchanges and extensive participation in the dialogue of world civilizations, we can not only fully demonstrate the long history and profoundness of Chinese excellent traditional culture, but also learn and study the world's highest level of literary and artistic achievements, and inspire the whole world. National cultural innovation creates vitality, so that the people of the world can better understand China, and let the Chinese people better understand the world.

At the opening ceremony of the 2022 Fuzhou Tang Xianzu Drama Festival, the Minhe high-accented local accent version of "The Peony Pavilion" was performed.

Photo by Chen Qiang

China News Agency reporter: Since 2017, you initiated the "Tang Xianzu International Cultural Exchange" project, from the perspective of overseas friends, through various forms of literature, poetry and artistic creation, to tell Chinese stories in their eyes.

What is the significance of these cultural exchange activities in promoting people-to-people bonds and mutual learning between Chinese and foreign civilizations?

Alan McFarlane:

I have been working hard to build a bridge of communication between China and foreign countries, so that people can understand and communicate with each other, and reflect on the development of civilization in their own country by understanding each other's civilization.

  We have long been committed to bringing various Chinese cultural forms to the UK, translating Chinese works, and inviting Chinese scholars and artists to visit, give lectures, exhibit and perform at Cambridge University, including hosting three Kunqu opera performances, workshops and Art exhibition.

We also regularly visit China with British experts, poets, writers and artists.

In 2019, the Chinese and overseas Chinese in the UK celebrated the 70th anniversary of the founding of the People's Republic of China and held the "Most Beautiful Blessings" at the Greenwood Theater in London.

The picture shows Yang Yuanfan, a young British composer and pianist, performing his piano concerto "The Peony Pavilion - A Dream in the Garden" for the first time.

Photo by Zhang Anqi

  The "Tang Xianzu International Cultural Exchange" project tells the story of Tang Xianzu's hometown Fuzhou in the eyes of overseas friends through various forms.

Compared with the themes of major international cities and backgrounds, it is very rare for foreigners to tell stories about non-first-tier cities in China.

It can not only show different levels of Chinese stories, let Western society understand the uniqueness and diversity of various regions in China, but also deepen their understanding of the soil that gave birth to Tang Xianzu.

  This project enables foreigners to have more opportunities to understand China's urban civilization and spirit, understand Tang Xianzu's life and the cultural and social life reflected in his works, and also allows Chinese people to learn more about the perspectives foreigners use to understand Chinese traditional culture.

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Respondent profile:

  Zhu Hong, professor and doctoral supervisor of Nanchang University, went to the Mass Media Research Center of the University of Leicester, UK in 1989 as a senior visiting scholar and honorary researcher.

Representative of the 13th National People's Congress, President of Jiangxi Culture and Tourism Research Promotion Association, chief expert of major national social science projects.

His main works include: "On Socialist Ideology", "From a Powerful Radio and Television Country to a Powerful Radio and Television Country", "Jiangxi Tourism Culture Series", "Jiangxi History and Culture Overview", "Jiangxi Symbols", "Opening the Book of Jiangxi", etc.

  Alan Macfarlane (Alan Macfarlane), Professor of Social Anthropology at the University of Cambridge, Fellow of King's College, Cambridge University, Fellow of the National Academy of Sciences, and co-founder of Cam River Press.

He has taught at the University of Cambridge for more than 40 years, and has written "The Origin of British Individualism", "The World of Glass", "Green Gold: Tea Empire", "Culture of Capitalism", "The Birth of the Modern World", etc., which have been translated into many languages, many of which There are Chinese translations of all works.