Tunisia -
Zuhair Al-Maghzawi, Secretary-General of the People's Movement (one of the parties supporting the path of the Tunisian president), said that Qais Saeed wasted a lot of time because of what he described as his mismanagement of the phase that followed the announcement of his exceptional measures on July 25, 2021, with which he dismissed the previous government and overthrew Parliament. .
Al-Maghzawi stressed - in an interview with Al-Jazeera Net - that the only thing he hopes to achieve after more than a year of announcing the exceptional measures is the organization of the upcoming elections, but he warned against a rise in reluctance to participate due to frustration and the deterioration of the economic and political conditions.
Al-Maghzawi criticized the performance of the current government, which was appointed by the president himself, because it did not take any measures to restore hope to the Tunisians, ruling out at the same time the ability of Qais Saeed's opponents to tip the scales.
The following is the text of the interview:
Zuhair Al-Maghzawi: We believed that Qais Saeed's measures were an opportunity to get out of a "corrupt democracy" after the past decade (Al-Jazeera)
First of all, what is the reason for your siding with the exceptional measures announced by the president in July 2021, even though some considered them a "coup" against constitutional legitimacy and state institutions?
We did not discuss the constitutional issue much when the president relied on Chapter 80 of the previous constitution to take exceptional measures, but we believed that these measures were an opportunity to get out of a "corrupt democracy" over the past decade to a healthy democracy that prioritizes reforming the situation.
The revolution of freedom and dignity in Tunisia raised slogans calling for employment and development, the most prominent of which was the slogan "Employment is a merit, O gang of thieves".
However, what happened was a complete shift in the path from a revolution of freedom and dignity to a mere democratic transition allied with internal corruption and subject to external forces.
Consequently, the demands of the Tunisians have not been fulfilled despite some political progress, although we have great reservations about it because of the electoral crimes and assassinations.
We, as a party, tried, whether through our representation in the previous parliament or our participation in the government of Elyes Fakhfakh, to reform the system from within in order to achieve the demands of the people, because we noticed that the political track did not succeed in placing the waiting of the people at the top of its priorities, but rather put the interests of politicians at the top of concerns.
The result is that the transition path witnessed a setback after the revolution and continuous protests against the ruling system due to the deteriorating conditions, and those protests reached their climax on July 25, 2021, with President Saeed announcing exceptional measures to end the previous failed system of government.
What were your requests after announcing these exceptional measures?
We clearly demanded from President Kais Saied, in the first statement we issued, that the exceptional period not be prolonged, and that the gains achieved after the revolution not be compromised. We called for focusing on political, economic and social reform, and reassuring Tunisians that the future will be better.
Do you still believe that what happened on "July 25" is an opportunity to deal with the situation, or has that opportunity vanished?
In fact, we wasted a lot of time, and we estimate that this opportunity has begun to diminish, and that the possibility of getting out of the crisis to a better situation has greatly diminished, because the president wasted a lot of time.
We expressed our support for the "July 25" stage, but we disagreed with the management of this stage, in which we saw a very bad administration, whether in terms of appointments or measures taken, or in terms of setting priorities for this stage, which are not only constitutional priorities as much as they are priority reforms. Urgent economic and social realization of the people's demands for development, employment, and so on.
You say that the president did not manage the stage well, so does he still have your confidence?
The president was agreed upon by most of the voters that he is a clean man and is able to change the facts in the country, and that he is a defender of the social role of the state, but what is disturbing to us is the difference between his presidential speech and his presidential practice, and we notice that the gap between them is widening day after day.
Although we still believe that the president can change the situation for the better, unfortunately, we have reached a point where horizons are blocked.
You thought that the "July 25 track" came to fix the deteriorating conditions over the past decade.
What has been achieved after a year and 4 months?
After July 25, we were convinced that no person, whatever his skills, could save the country without the participation of the rest of the parties, and we believed that the date of July 25 was not the making of the president, but rather the making of people, parties, organizations, and the media, and therefore the president had to involve those parties. in change.
Unfortunately, the president was unique in his opinion, and participatory was very weak, whether when drafting the constitution, the election law, or setting priorities.
Although we absolutely supported the "July 25 path", the only thing we hope to achieve after more than a year is the upcoming elections.
Today, we still call on the President of the Republic not to miss this opportunity, which gave a dose of hope to Tunisians.
And I told the president in some meetings that he would bear the historical responsibility in the event that he missed this opportunity for the country, which would enter into very dangerous pitfalls due to the expanding state of frustration.
Protests in Tunisia against the exceptional measures taken by President Qais Said (Al-Jazeera)
You talked about the absence of participatory writing of the constitution. Do you think that the Kais Saied constitution is better than the 2014 constitution?
The new constitution is better than the previous one because it has several advantages, especially with regard to emphasizing the social role of the state, in addition to the economic aspect that was not present in the previous constitution, as well as emphasizing the identity of the Arab-Islamic countries more than the previous constitution.
But some say the new constitution has weakened parliament's powers.
Is not it right?
Of course, the parliament’s powers in the new constitution are less, because the philosophy of the new constitution relied on the presidential system instead of the previous parliamentary system, which was concentrated after the revolution, given that there was a kind of complex from the presidential system because of the tyranny that occurred before the revolution.
A modified parliamentary system was adopted, but we were convinced that it was a hybrid system that created a political crisis in the country, and was dividing the executive authority between two heads (the president and the head of government). Without any doubt, the previous constitution and the political system that established it was one of the main factors in creating the crisis in the country.
However, what is wrong with the Qais Said constitution is that there is no accountability for the President of the Republic, but it has advantages compared to the 2014 constitution, especially with regard to the ease of amending the new constitution compared to the amendment of the 2014 constitution, which was almost impossible to amend.
Who bears the most prominent responsibility for the deterioration of the situation after the revolution?
Wasn't the political class in its various formations a reason for losing the confidence of Tunisians?
Of course, everyone bears the responsibility, but political Islam, that is, the Ennahda Movement, bears the greatest responsibility.
Because it was the backbone of governance throughout the past decade.
The Ennahda movement had its historic opportunity after the revolution, and the people were fair to it after its leaders were in prisons and exiles, but it missed the opportunity for itself and the Tunisians by allying with the previous regime and with corruption and the corrupt and covering them up.
Today, we hold it responsible for the greatest share of failure during the past decade, and we say that "July 25" is the anniversary of the revolution against the renaissance, just as the date of January 14, 2011 was the anniversary of the revolution against the previous regime.
Some believe that the difficult living conditions in Tunisia will lead to a great abstention from the elections.
How do you see that?
In the last meeting with President Kais Saied, I alerted him to this issue because we believe that there is an automatic link between economic and social conditions and people going to the polls.
Since 2011, we have noticed a significant decline in the number of participants, because people do not see that going to the polls will change their reality.
Consequently, the continued deterioration of the situation without taking measures related to basic materials or rising prices will automatically lead to people's reluctance to attend the upcoming elections on December 17.
Qais Said and the prime minister appointed by Naglaa Boudin (Tunisian press)
What is your assessment of the performance of the current government appointed by the president himself?
Were they up to the challenges posed and creating the environment for holding elections?
This government is silent, and we have not seen any decisions or procedures mentioned by it, and whoever bears the main responsibility is the President of the Republic because he chose it himself.
We believed that the president would involve the parties supporting the "July 25" track to engage in political reforms, including reforming the constitution.
On the other hand, we believed that the president would choose a government capable of supporting this reform path with measures that ease the hardship of the situation on the people, but we noticed that this government mismanages, regardless of the legacy of crises and the repercussions of the health pandemic and the Ukrainian war.
The government negotiated a new loan with the IMF, in return for adhering to some conditions, without the involvement of social and political parties.
What are the repercussions of this on the situation of Tunisians, the stability of the country, and the political track?
Our position is clear, which is that this government is only a caretaker government, and it does not have the powers to sign an agreement with the International Monetary Fund in exchange for lifting subsidies or privatizing public institutions, and we warn that harming subsidies or public institutions will create a social revolution.
Some say that the electoral process witnessed irregularities during the stage of submitting nominations.
Such as using corrupt money and exploiting clan influence to run.
How do you assess the integrity of this path?
The same president who drafted the electoral law spoke of abuses such as the use of corrupt money, and this is one of the results of his uniqueness in preparing the electoral law without any consultation.
Thus, the current electoral path is no different from the previous electoral paths, which witnessed many electoral crimes.
Regardless of the current election law's reliance on the voting system for individuals rather than party lists, we see that it has many breaches and did not create an electoral climate that cuts off with corrupt political money or with the administration's employment to present nominations and other electoral crimes.
In addition, the Elections Law set unfair conditions when submitting candidacies, especially with regard to the requirement that the candidate obtain 400 recommendations from voters and be approved by the municipalities.
This led to a decline in the number of nominations, and even to the fact that no candidacy was submitted in 8 constituencies abroad.
A demonstration in the capital, Tunis, against Qais Said (Al-Jazeera)
How do you see the escalation of opposition against the president?
Do you think that she is able to turn the scales with her mobilization in the street?
exactly the contrary;
I think that the president is benefiting in the current period from all the mistakes made by the parties opposing him during the past decade.
The opposition is mainly the Ennahda movement and the elites that revolve around it, as it is trying to recycle itself again, and I believe that those who oppose the "July 25 path" have failed to change the balance of power despite all their attempts to mobilize the street or seek help from abroad.
Several parties announced their boycott of the elections, claiming that the president's course was illegitimate.
How do you see the future of these parties?
Boycott is a respectful and sovereign decision for the parties, and any party has the right to take the decision it wants, but the importance of the issue lies in the percentage of participation in the upcoming elections and their success. If there is a turnout according to the accepted standards, then the country will move to a new political process, and then we will not find many parties Boycott in the next political scene.
On the other hand, several parties that called for a boycott do not exist practically on the ground, and there are parties that did not hold their conferences, and others that were not represented even by one seat in the previous parliament.
Some believe that the election law drafted by the president, with a system of voting for individuals, wanted to weaken the parties.
How true are these estimates?
Indeed, the president believes that moderate bodies such as parties have ended, but of course we differ with him in his position and are aware of this issue regardless of our support for him.
After "July 25," we carried out a long series of meetings and moves to send a message that parties cannot be destroyed by a presidential decision.
Apart from the parties that previously played a role in brokering and achieving spoils by exploiting positions, I do not think that anyone can cancel honest parties when they play their role in framing the masses, establishing true democracy within them, and listening to people's demands.
Will the next parliament be influential and able to create balances with the president, especially since some expect the rise of dispersed deputies who do not have any partisan framework?
In fact, the next parliament will not be worse than the previous parliaments, in which figures related to crimes rose, and some were running for parliament in order to gain immunity, including smugglers or incompetent people.
And the issue of achieving balances with the head of state or his government will be linked to the nature of the deputies who will ascend.
But I believe that the next parliament is important because it is the source of legislation, and therefore the president has no choice but to choose: either to clash with the parliament or to find formulas to deal with the blocs in it to pass laws.
How did the People's Movement prepare itself to run in the upcoming legislative elections?
We ran in most of the electoral districts (161 in number), and we believe that our chances will be ample because we are in relationship with people daily through our candidates and our structures in the regions, and we are one of the most growing parties as we were represented by two deputies in 2011, then by 3 deputies in the 2014 parliament, then by 15 deputies in the parliament 2019;
And this is thanks to our defense of the people, our honesty, the cleanliness of our hands and the democracy that we have built within our party.