Interview with Markus Söder: "Russia is not an enemy of Europe"

Prime Minister, NATO is deploying soldiers around Ukraine.

What to do?

Timo Frasch

Political correspondent in Munich.

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Konrad Schuller

Political correspondent for the Frankfurter Allgemeine Sunday newspaper in Berlin.

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It is a serious situation when conflicts escalate at Europe's borders. Most importantly, we must reject aggression and avoid escalation. Nobody can want a war in Europe. In doing so, the territorial integrity and independence of Ukraine under international law must be respected. But constant new threats and ever tougher sanctions against Russia alone cannot be the solution. On the one hand, because sanctions have had little effect for a long time and, on the other hand, because these new sanctions would often harm us just as much. For example, an exclusion of Russia from the financial system SWIFT. Keeping the Nord Stream 2 Baltic Sea pipeline closed or even stopping all gas supplies from Russia in general would also affect our country.Even at the worst of the Cold War, there was no questioning of the energy link between the Soviet Union and Germany. Despite all justified criticism of Russia, at some point the West will have to answer the key question: Is there a plan to expand NATO to include Ukraine or not? You certainly can't let Russia dictate anything here. But you still have to give an answer. In my view, one thing is clear: NATO's eastward expansion to include Ukraine will not be on the agenda for a long time.But you still have to give an answer. In my view, one thing is clear: NATO's eastward expansion to include Ukraine will not be on the agenda for a long time.But you still have to give an answer. In my view, one thing is clear: NATO's eastward expansion to include Ukraine will not be on the agenda for a long time.

According to its statutes, NATO is open to every democratic European country. To exclude Ukraine would be to give in to Russian blackmail.

Protecting our allies, such as Poland and the Baltic States, is a military alliance obligation. But the same is not true in Ukraine: this is not a NATO case. It is a matter of clarity and honesty to define a strategy that takes this into account while protecting Ukraine's territorial integrity. Russia is a difficult partner, but not an enemy of Europe. The majority of Germans want stable and peaceful relations with Russia. One thing is clear: Russia is not a regional power. Russia is and will remain a great power. We are firmly anchored in the West, but we have to keep in touch with Moscow – even if it is always a challenge.

After World War II, the West surrendered all of Eastern Europe to the Soviet Union at the Yalta Conference. In 2008, in Bucharest, NATO promised Ukraine admission. Should she now break the promise and leave Eastern Europe to a new Moscow hegemony?

Of course, there are significant differences with Russia.

But in terms of realpolitik, we also need stability.

It is a contradiction in terms when the traffic light government makes tough demands on Russia on the one hand, but is not willing to make its own contribution to more security on the other.

We must fundamentally strengthen the Bundeswehr and make it more robust.

That's why it doesn't make sense if some want to deliver green weapons to Ukraine and at the same time talk about arms export restrictions.

I can't imagine German arms deliveries to Ukraine.

On the other hand, a joint European contribution to supporting Ukraine and defusing the conflict makes sense.

How, then, should Russia be made aware of the price of its actions?

With a dual strategy of dialogue and clear lines. Russia needs to know that there are borders in Europe that must not be crossed. I think the reference to consequences is correct, but you also have to know what it can lead to in the end. In any case, the goal cannot be to send German soldiers to Ukraine. Unfortunately, the EU does not sit at the table when Europe's security is being discussed. The USA should at least have taken the EU Commission President with them. We should take the problems in Europe back into our own hands. The Munich Security Conference in February offers the opportunity to bring the parties to the conflict together. I propose that in Munich at the conference we revive the Normandy format with Germany, France, Russia and Ukraine.