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The dispute in the SPD over identity politics has been simmering for over a week: How much must society take into account the sensitivities of sexual and other minorities?
Initially, ex-Bundestag President Wolfgang Thierse publicly complained about an increasingly aggressive debate about racism and gender.
As a result, SPD leader Saskia Esken and her deputy Kevin Kühnert complained about a "backward-looking picture" of the party that some drew.
What does Jessica Rosenthal, chairwoman of the SPD Youth, think of the debate?
The SPD conflict over Thierse
WORLD:
Ms. Rosenthal, the Juso Federal Association has so far been publicly silent on the Thierse cause.
Is the subject too hot for you?
Jessica Rosenthal:
That's not too hot for me at all, but it's better to talk to each other than about each other.
Besides, I don't think that's a real issue, that shouldn't be too high a priority now.
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WORLD:
Talking to one another instead of about one another - is that now a criticism of Esken?
Rosenthal:
Not at all.
Why also?
WORLD:
Because Esken and Kühnert have declared that they are ashamed of an attitude like the Thierses - without having spoken to him.
Jessica Rosenthal, 28, is a teacher in Bonn.
She has been chairwoman of the Jusos since January
Source: Marcus Simaitis
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Rosenthal:
Saskia Esken and Kevin Kühnert sought a dialogue with the queer community - so they stand for dialogue, which I expressly support.
Basically speaking about one another instead of one another does not correspond to my political culture, and everyone involved certainly sees it the same way.
That is why there are talks in this case.
I cannot and would not like to say more about this.
WORLD:
Thierse is in favor of blackfacing - i.e. when whites put on make-up to embody blacks - should continue to be possible.
Are such an attitude and the way in which Thierse is dealt with is nothing that the SPD should publicly debate?
Rosenthal:
As the SPD, we make socially just politics and at the same time we fight against discrimination.
That is mutually dependent.
So there are enough big issues that the SPD is now concerned with: Unequal educational opportunities due to Corona, rising unemployment, structural racism ...
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WORLD:
Another focus of yours is the fight against sexism.
Do you think society is sexist?
Rosenthal:
In part it is, of course.
I don't know any comrade, colleague or friend who has not had sexist experiences.
But we shouldn't always speak of sexism in society in such an abstract way in this context.
That means everyone and nobody.
We have to look at the structures of this sexism; this is the only way we can successfully counter it.
WORLD:
Which structures do you mean specifically?
Rosenthal:
That women make up half of the population, but not half of the wealth, half of the good jobs, half of the positions of power.
As examples.
You have to do something about it.
Or that in everyday situations, such as at kitchen parties, women's jokes are cracked and nobody says: Hey, that doesn't work.
WORLD:
Is gendering the language an effective tool against sexism?
Rosenthal:
It is really under-complex to reduce the feminist struggle to gendering the language.
Nobody in this fight believes that that alone is decisive.
We have to fight the basic structures of discrimination and sexism.
And yes: we do not live in a better world with gender asterisks and internal I.
But what does it cost to recognize in this way that half of people are women?
Language creates images in the head, and when we adjust the language, we change those images too.
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WORLD:
You are a teacher, let's be honest: Aren't these gender asterisks and inner constructions horrible to look at and hardly to be pronounced?
Rosenthal:
Language is changing, and if we now deal more sensitively with the question of the extent to which it takes the position of women into account, that's okay.
We say kindergarten teachers, a really long word, but hardly anyone says boss.
This shows that our language is still patriarchal.
But if you don't want to use the gender asterisk, don't use it.
I like to explain why it makes sense, but I don't start a star mission.
Because with the debate about the gender star, one tries again and again to counter the fundamental questions of our fight for equality - especially by those who do not want to lead it: It is about helping single parents more, that women are paid fairly, and also get adequate pensions.
Women get 40 percent of the pensions that men receive.
We have to fight that.
WORLD:
You are calling for a parity law for parliaments so that men and women are equally represented there.
Shouldn't such quotas then also exist for other social groups?
Rosenthal:
The equality of women and men is in the Basic Law;
in this respect it is clear that we should finally implement this.
That does not mean that we now need quotas for every social group.
In the parliaments we see that the proportion of women is stagnating, and the SPD must and wants to do something about this.
Unlike the conservative parties.
WORLD:
The conservative parties provide the chancellor and have ensured that a woman has become the EU Commission President.
The SPD has a man as candidate for chancellor and a male parliamentary group leader.
Rosenthal:
That's right, but we shouldn't just look at top positions, but at the entire parliamentary groups and parties.
And women are extremely underrepresented in the conservative camp.
It's different with the SPD.
But of course I'm not saying that we have already reached our goal.
On the contrary: We will only get better with a self-critical look at our own structures - regardless of whether it is about diversity or the representation of women.
As the SPD, we accept this challenge every day and want to get better.
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WORLD:
In order to enforce gender equality, you demand: “Abortions must get out of the penal code.” Should it still be possible to have an abortion in the eighth or ninth month?
Rosenthal:
We Jusos fight for women's rights, which of course includes the right to self-determination about one's own body.
The decision to terminate the pregnancy is closely monitored by doctors.
Decriminalization does not mean that abortions should be done so late.
WORLD:
How much Juso content is there in the draft election program of the SPD leadership?
Rosenthal:
A lot.
It's a good future program, so there has to be a lot of the Jusos in it.
The principle that strong shoulders have to carry more applies again.
It says how we intend to eliminate wealth inequality.
In the meantime, wealth in Germany is again distributed as it was in feudal aristocratic societies.
And it's not about just taking money away, it's about distributing and investing it properly.
In expanding our infrastructure, in schools, in digitization, in promoting Germany as a business location and in the ecological transformation of our economy.
If we want to keep Germany as an industrial location, we have to invest.
Chancellor candidate Scholz presents the SPD election program
In its election manifesto, the SPD strongly focuses on the issues of climate protection and social justice.
Chancellor candidate Olaf Scholz outlines the priorities - Greens and leftists react calmly.
Source: WORLD / Isabell Finzel
WORLD:
Noble society?
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Rosenthal:
Yes, as far as assets are concerned.
Some have a lot more and accumulate more and more of them.
And it's not about the inherited house from grandma, but about millions and billions.
At the same time, poverty is growing, and Hartz IV puts people under general suspicion and sidelined.
The scissors keep widening.
That is why it is so important that the wealth tax we are demanding becomes a reality, that we finally put an end to Hartz IV. The election manifesto contains many points for which we as Jusos have been fighting for years.
WORLD:
With the Hartz reforms of Gerhard Schröder's government, Germany got back on its feet economically, many new jobs were created ...
Rosenthal:
... and often precarious employment.
But we shouldn't look back all the time.
In order to create the upcoming change, we need a new approach to the design of the welfare state.
And the citizens' money we are proposing is the right one, the fairer one.
It ensures that I don't lose everything if I become unemployed for a while, but that the state helps me get out of the situation.
WORLD:
How high should the citizens' money be?
Rosenthal: As
far as the minimum rates are concerned, we need an increase compared to the Hartz rates.
The socio-cultural and socio-economic subsistence level must be guaranteed.
That of the children too, which is why the basic child security we propose is so important.
Life under Hartz conditions and child poverty are mutually dependent, we have to do something about that.
Simply because children are our most important resource.
It is a question of justice that everyone, regardless of their parents' income, can lead the life they want.
In the Corona year, over 13 million Germans are considered poor
Poverty in Germany is at a record high.
This emerges from the current study by the Paritätischer Wohlfahrtsverband.
It is particularly alarming that a third of those affected work and are still poor.
Source: WELT / David Schafbuch
WORLD:
You are pushing for ticket-free local transport.
Should everyone be able to travel by bus and train for free in the future?
Rosenthal:
If we really want to fight climate change, yes.
Then everyone should be able to take the bus in front of the door and leave the car.
Without having to buy a ticket.
This works best through a contribution system.
WORLD:
So everyone pays for buses and trains, regardless of whether they use it.
The cyclists too?
Rosenthal:
Cyclists can then also travel by train and bus - and no longer have to buy an additional ticket for their bike if they want to take it with them.
The system would be based on solidarity. The contributions to local transport would then also be based on how well it is developed and what someone can contribute to it with a view to their financial situation.
WORLD:
Transport companies say that without ticket revenue, around half of the revenue would be missing, i.e. billions.
That should be financed through contributions?
Rosenthal:
If we want to expand public transport and get people to switch, we need such a contribution system.
And if the contributions are not enough, we have to think about additional tax subsidies.
It is clear that we need a system change if we want to stop climate change.
And for that we have to dare to do something.