- With a calendar turned upside down by the health crisis linked to Covid-19, the 150 people drawn by lot from the Citizen's Climate Convention meet in Paris, Friday and Sunday, for their last working session.
- The challenge ? Vote the 150 measures intended to reduce emissions of French greenhouse gases identified during the nine months of work, then submit their report, Sunday, to the executive.
- "These 150 citizens have done an incredible job," said Laurence Tubiana, co-chair of the governance committee for this citizen convention. She is therefore awaiting the return of the executive, who wanted this convention to be up to the challenge.
On the one hand, 150 citizens drawn by lot and representative of French society. On the other, a mission: to propose measures to reduce French greenhouse gas emissions by at least 40% by 2030, in a logic of social justice. Mix it all up and you get the Citizen Climate Convention, desired by Emmanuelle Macron as a response to the “yellow vests” crisis.
The initial calendar provided for six weekends of work at the Economic, Social and Environmental Council (Cese) in Paris, for a presentation of the conclusions of the convention to the government first scheduled for late January, then early April.
Meanwhile, the Covid-19 has been there. The 150 members of the convention do not finally meet until this Friday and until Sunday for their seventh working session. That which must lead to the final vote on the 150 measures currently retained by the convention then to the delivery of the report detailing them, this Sunday, to the executive.
In other words, almost the end of this experience of participatory democracy unprecedented on this scale and on the theme of global warming. "Then all that remains is to wait for Emmanuel Macron's response," said Laurence Tubiana, co-chair of the governance committee for this citizens' convention. The French diplomat, director general of the European climate foundation and professor at Sciences Po, answers questions from 20 Minutes .
Is it already a relief that this citizens' climate convention can go all the way?
Yes of course. This convention was due to end in principle in February and we had initially organized all the work over six work weekends, close to each other. The Covid-19 crisis turned the program upside down. We were afraid that this convention could not go to the end, or even that it could not meet physically to vote on the final proposals. It would have been sad all the same. The 150 citizens have in any case not given up. The governance committee was able to measure their commitment very early on through participation in work weekends, but also various online meetings organized between sessions. This attendance was confirmed during confinement. The participants continued to work like crazy and we finish today with more than 150 citizens, knowing that we had put together a small reserve list, from the start, to compensate for any defections.
Have there still been moments of tension in recent months, particularly around the decision to send or not the first fifty questions to the government in mid-April?
The question has indeed been widely debated. The stake was to know if the convention was in its role by transmitting to Emmanuel Macron, without having finished its work, fifty first proposals to nourish the reflection on the plan of exit of crisis which prepared the government. And whether or not to make this letter public [it ultimately leaked to the press]. But this debate is healthy and has led to a real majority among these 150 citizens. This example is fairly representative of how the work was carried out. There was no soft consensus during this convention, but each time debates led with great seriousness.
In the end, does this Covid-19 health crisis give more weight to the work of this commission?
Yes, paradoxically. We are in a health crisis which is turning into an economic and social crisis. In this context, we could have imagined that thinking about how to reduce our greenhouse gas emissions is no longer considered relevant. It did not happen. This issue remained very present in the reflections and debates that many French people had during the confinement. Unexpectedly then, this convention represents a kind of citizens' point of view for the next world. His final report seems in any case eagerly awaited, from NGOs as parliamentarians or even Emmanuel Macron, who alluded to it in his televised speech on Sunday.
Last October, you said you were betting that society was ahead of politics on the issues of ecological transition. Did this citizen convention confirm you in this idea?
We will see this weekend what the 150 citizens and the majorities that will emerge will vote for. But yes, the work carried out so far by this convention has comforted me in this feeling. An example: in the government's recovery plan, several measures aim to accelerate the deployment of electric vehicles. In the 50 proposals sent in mid-April to Emmanuel Macron, the convention proposed to go further on this subject. In particular by adopting measures dissuading the purchase of polluting vehicles or by conditioning more strongly the aid for the purchase of electric vehicles in favor of the poorest households. This is just an illustration. Same thing on the Constitution, the role of the private car, the artificialisation of the soil, the agricultural and food model: the 150 citizens go further than the current political proposals.
Are there completely new solutions to the ecological transition in these 150 proposals?
One of the stubborn criticisms against the citizens' convention consisted in saying that it was not going to invent anything, that the solutions are already known to carry out the ecological transition. On several subjects all the same, she tried to be innovative and looked into themes that had been little taken into account until then in the ecological transition, such as advertising or education. But finding new solutions was not the mission of this convention. We could not ask these 150 citizens to become experts and reinvent the wheel in a few months. Its mission was to study all the proposals on the table, to determine those which seem the most solid today and to discuss under what conditions they can be implemented.
Should we then see this convention as a social thermometer?
No, it's more than that. With this convention, we are not in the poll or the consultation, but in the deliberation. For each of the proposals, the 150 citizens weighed the pros and cons, debated each other's arguments, before saying: "This is what we think about it". They functioned somewhat like a grand jury. And, once again, the work done since October is incredible. A lot of proposals emerged. Some have asked "why so much?". I remember that they tackle many themes, activate various levers - sometimes education, sometimes economic incentive, sometimes constraint - and, ultimately, form a whole, a coherent whole. It is a roadmap that the convention will propose to the government.
Do you have more details today on how Emmanuel Macron will take into account the work of this commission?
We do not yet know who, within the executive, will receive the conclusions of the convention on Sunday. I hope that this reception will be up to the investment of the citizens and that we will know, from Sunday, when the President of the Republic intends to respond to the various measures. The 150 citizens will be vigilant on this point. Several already on social networks remind Emmanuel Macron of his promises. By launching this convention, he undertook to submit without filter, to Parliament or even to a referendum, the proposals for direct application of the convention. This does not concern all 150 proposals. Some are indeed very successful and even already translated into articles of law. But others still merit further reflection or concern other skill scales. Regional for example, or on the contrary European.
Has this Citizens' Convention already won a victory by giving “a second wind to democracy”, as the 55 deputies who wrote an open letter to him on Tuesday write?
I think so. This convention was launched in a context of great distrust towards it, on the part of many actors. From some parliamentarians to some NGOs, including unions. Many have changed their judgments since then. I can now hear some members wondering if the citizens' conventions cannot be envisaged in the future as a means of extending parliamentary work.
It would indeed be interesting if there were other citizen conventions to follow. Not only on the climate, but on all the subjects which require profound transformations in our societies. These citizens' conventions are a condition for getting out of the classic pattern of representative democracy, which generates a lot of distrust today. It is often said that citizens no longer trust institutions. To restore it, politicians must also have confidence in citizens, give them credit, involve them in decision-making. The citizens' agreement is a tool that allows it. If they feel listened to, if we stop infantilizing them, perhaps citizens will no longer consider politicians as incapable.
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How will this last working session take place?
The 150 citizens will meet as usual, as of Friday, at the Palais Jena, in Paris, headquarters of Cese, for three days of work. "As a reminder, there was a first debate in March on the measures identified by the Convention, then a second debate on proposed amendments [text modifications] to these measures, during a webinar in late May" , begins Julien Blanchet, general rapporteur of the Citizen's Climate Convention. This is where the convention stands today: with around 150 amended proposals. "This weekend, they will deliberate, adopt, and then identify the measures they wish to propose in a referendum," continues Julien Blanchet.
The whole will feed a final report which will be submitted to the executive this Sunday. This document will not only contain raw proposals. "Minority opinions will also appear in the agreement for each of the proposals, adds Julien Blanchet. It seemed important to us that those who did not agree with a proposal voted by the majority could put forward their arguments. There is still the introduction and the conclusion to be refined and voted on, as well as to complete the synthesis of the debates held.
All this will give a report of several hundred pages which calls for the executive response. The constitution will not give up on this point, we warn within the governance committee of the convention. Its 150 members have already formed an association to be able to better monitor, over time, the response to their proposals.
- Planet