“Russian atomic troika”: how nuclear weapons were created in the USSR

- Vladimir Stepanovich, you were present at the testing of nuclear weapons. How it was?

- There are some very scary things in this world when a person has a feeling of physiological fear. For example, when you first attend the launch of a rocket. But it is even worse to observe nuclear testing. You are standing far from the site of the explosion. And suddenly the earth rises before you! Rises a wall! Then dots appear in it, which are getting brighter. Then flames burst from them! This wall is detached from the surface and goes up - everything happens in seconds!

- What year was it?

- In 1965. It was an underground explosion in Kazakhstan. At one time, the head of the atomic project, Igor Kurchatov, insisted that every great scientist share his impressions of nuclear testing. On the one hand, they were shocked by the monstrous destructive power of the new weapon. On the other hand, they confessed that it was an amazing sight.

• Nuclear fungus ground explosion RDS-1 August 29, 1949
• © Museum of Nuclear Weapons RFNC-VNNEF / Wikipedia

- How was the work on the creation of the atomic bomb ?

- Work on the atomic project was carried out in three directions. Kurchatov was engaged in plutonium, Isaac Kikoin - isotope separation, Lev Artsimovich - by electromagnetic methods of uranium extraction. Each of these three areas could lead to the creation of a nuclear bomb. All scientists were on an equal footing. It was the "Russian atomic troika", which was carried forward to the discoveries.

- No one knew which option would work?

- Not. But our intelligence data obtained in the West indicated that everything could work out with plutonium. It was Kurchatov who was allowed to those secret intelligence materials that came to Lawia Beria.

• Igor Kurchatov in the laboratory of the Leningrad Institute of Physics and Technology of the USSR Academy of Sciences, 1929
• RIA News

- From USA?

- First from England, and then from America. Largely thanks to these materials, Kurchatov very quickly advanced in his work. He unmistakably determined in which direction to go, and in which he should not, because it is a dead end. This was his great merit. Especially important were the data from the United States on the Manhattan project, which the scout Klaus Fuchs transmitted. These documents were a huge help in the work - more than 10 thousand pages with a detailed description of the reactors and the design of the bomb. However, it was necessary first of all to make sure that all this is true. In addition, no one knew how the correct way was set out in Western works, so the matter had to be approached very creatively.

• Vladimir Gubarev, editor of the science department of the newspaper Pravda
• RIA News
• © Boris Prikhodko

- In your book you published a report-report dated June 18, 1945 that 39 German scientists and engineers went to the USSR. How decisive was their role in the Soviet atomic project?

- There are several German scientists who have played a significant role in this work, for example, Nikolaus Rill. In fact, he created Plant No. 12 in Electrostal, where the first metallic uranium for the atomic bomb was obtained. Riel led uranium production for five years. He, the only German in history, was awarded the highest Soviet title - Hero of Socialist Labor - after testing an atomic bomb. German scientists brought with them all the equipment associated with physical processes. The work of these specialists was of great importance also for the reason that after the war, very few specialists in nuclear physics remained in the USSR.

- Killed ...

- Yes. At the same time, they included those who taught at school, that is, did not study science. In my opinion, those groups of scientists who came from Germany to the USSR played a big role.

- Riel in his book “Ten years in a golden cage” wrote: “In the field of nuclear energy, the Soviets themselves would have achieved their goal, without the Germans. One year, or at the most two years later. ” Do you agree with this?

- Absolutely! Only I believe that it is impossible to determine exactly how long Soviet scientists would create nuclear weapons.

“I will quote the letter of the legendary physicist Peter Kapitsa to Joseph Stalin:“ Comrades Lawrence Beria, Georgy Malenkov and Nikolai Voznesensky behave in the work on the atomic project as supermen. Especially comrade Beria . He has a "baton" in his hands, he oversees our work. That's not bad. Comrade Beria’s main weakness is that the conductor must not only wave his wand, but also understand the score ”. When Beria demanded approval for the arrest of Kapitsa, Stalin said: "I will dismiss him, but you do not touch him."

- Yes, it was so.

• Peter Kapitsa
• RIA News

- I was shocked that Kapitsa could openly oppose Beria.

- The fact is that Stalin himself asked that Kapitsa give him his assessment of the progress of work and the problems of the atomic project.

- In your book, you quote Ril's statement that he worked under a contract in the USSR.

- We must take into account what happened in post-war Germany. There was not that poverty - complete devastation! Work in the Soviet project saved the German scientists, so they signed contracts. Naturally, their freedom was limited. Some experts worked on the islands, far from civilization, others could not go beyond the boundaries of a particular territory. As for Riel, he worked under total control. At the same time, German scientists received a salary of ten times more than Soviet specialists, and returned from the USSR by rich people.

- Stalin carefully studied the reports of physicists atomic project?

- He knew everything on this issue and stood above everything.

Only Beria and Stalin knew about the real situation in the atomic project. Malenkov and Nikita Khrushchev, who then came to power, had no idea what an atomic project was, so they did a lot of stupid things.

One of the biggest was the creation of a thermonuclear aviation Tsar-bomb.

• August 2, 1945. Nikita Khrushchev, Joseph Stalin, George Malenkov, Lavrenty Beria, Vyacheslav Molotov
• RIA News

- Why do you think so?

- It did not make sense. Many physicists, in particular Kurchatov and Kirill Shchelkin, who were key figures in the atomic project, objected to the production of Tsar-bomb. As a result, Andrei Sakharov said he would do it. But why? It was a big consumption of material.

- As far as I remember, after the creation of the Tsar Bomb, the Treaty on the Prohibition of Nuclear Weapon Tests in the Atmosphere, in Outer Space and Under Water was signed.

- Not certainly in that way. On April 12, 1961, we sent Yuri Gagarin into space. That is, it showed that our rocket was better than the American. On October 30 of the same year we experienced the Tsar Bomb. The shock wave from the explosion went around the globe three times. This was the beginning of the nuclear arms race and the Cold War. It was after this that the Caribbean crisis of 1962 broke out, which put the world on the brink of disaster. And the contract was signed only in 1963.

- In the West, they realized that now Soviet missiles can carry powerful charges to the right place?

- Of course. Why did the Caribbean crisis come about? After all, not because of the fact that the diplomats worked incorrectly. In the early 1960s, John F. Kennedy asked the military what cities could destroy the USSR in the United States. They replied: "New York." Then the president said that he could not "risk even one American city, because in the Soviet Union a rocket aimed at New York was at the start." The fate of the world was decided by the nuclear power of this or that country. By the way, the USSR only in 1972 reached nuclear parity with the United States. From this point on, the Soviet Union would have been able to destroy 80% of their potential.

• The full-scale mock-up of the Tsar-bomb AN602 at the Museum of Nuclear Weapons RFNC-VNIIEF
• © Wikipedia

- You wrote in your books that the mention of participation in nuclear testing was equal to treason.

- Yes. Once I asked Zeldovich, one of the creators of the atomic and hydrogen bombs, to share with me the memories of the first nuclear test. It was already the end of the 1960s, that is, 20 years after the end of these events. After reviewing some of the documents, the scientist said that he had no right to disclose anything for another six or seven years. The same thing happened with Julius Khariton.

- How high was the level of secrecy?

- The system of secrecy was an exact copy of the American.

However, the Soviet atomic program was different from the US in that there were several people in the US who worked for us, whereas in the USSR there was not a single specialist who worked for Washington.

Watch the full interview at RTD.