“Sex is just a thread”

- How did you become the host of the program "About It"?

- I appeared on television in 1987 when I worked in the Moscow News newspaper and became the first Soviet journalist to go on an internship to America. At that time, the program “Vzglyad” appeared on the then Soviet television. Started Leaves, Zakharov and Lyubimov. Every time I came from the United States, I was invited to talk about how things are going in America with a topic. For example, about how they fight AIDS there, is it true that this is a disease of gays and sex workers, where to run and how to protect themselves.

In 1989, I again left for the USA at the invitation of the Rockefeller Foundation. For the next few years, I trained at Harvard University, dreamed of working at CNN, and lived in New York, which I loved. In 1997, I was already studying at New York University as a psychotherapist, had practice and knew which hospital I would work in. And when they called me with a proposal to broadcast in Russia, I refused at first - because everything worked out so well in America.

Why did you end up agreeing?”

- This program was invented by Leonid Parfyonov, he chose me as the host. For me it was a great and serious test.

I was raised in a Soviet family, where they did not say "about it." She grew up on films in which lovers kissed, the camera went into the sky, cranes flew there, light instrumental music played - and we understood that everything had happened. It seemed to me important to finally talk directly about this part of each person’s life.

It was not easy to broadcast, it was constantly necessary to look for synonyms. I remember there was an ether where we talked about the process itself. I was embarrassed because words that were not ethereal came to my mind. Then someone suggested to me that you can use the synonyms “possess”, “love”, “enjoy”. And my excitement immediately went away.

- How did it happen that the heroes of the program agreed to talk about their problems throughout the country?

- I had an amazing team. I believe that the success of the project by 20-30% depends on the host, and the rest is the work of editors who find the heroes of the program, take preliminary interviews from them and see how sincere the participants are. It was important to understand why they basically want to come to the program. For example, some people wanted to take part in order to settle accounts, say the whole country that the partner is experiencing difficulties in the sexual sphere.

  • © Photo from the personal archive

- What, in your opinion, were the most important issues raised during this time?

- I consider “About It” primarily a social program, and sex is just a thread on which topics are strung.

We were the first to talk about homosexuality. A gay guy came to us, we asked if his parents knew. He replied: "Now they will find out." He considered it important to make this coming-out, because so many guys are sitting at home and do not know if they need to open up and what will happen if they do it.

We were also the first to talk about sex education at school, about sexual abuse at work. A girl came to us, who worked as an assistant secretary, told how she was forced to go to the bathhouse, go on business trips, implying that there she would provide all the related “services”. By the way, then her mother came, called her daughter a brazen girl - you see, she does not want to have sex with her boss.

I constantly had the feeling that we were pioneers, that I was walking on untouched snow and did not see any traces anywhere. It’s scary because you don’t know what is under this snow. There were no frames, beacons, they did not demand anything from us. Personally, I had the only criterion - that the topic did not cause disgust and disgust.

- One of the most piercing broadcasts was about the sex of people with disabilities. Tell us about this release.

- The heroine had cerebral palsy, her husband also had a disability, both of them moved in wheelchairs. The girl did not see her husband for years: they lived separately, although not far, and the parents did not want to bring them to each other. They thought that there was no need, because they still could not get out of the wheelchair. But when they talked about how they love each other and what sex is for them ... That girl said that sex is in my head, even when they just hold hands. And it can be much better than a healthy person. The audience listened so carefully that the fly would not fly unnoticed. I am proud of such transfers.

- Surely a lot of letters came to the address of the transfer. What were they like?

- Totally different. There were complaints: how can we show such disgusting late at night that such a disgusting transmission should be banned. At the same time, we received many letters of gratitude from women - for example, when we made a release on frigidity and it turned out that most often the problem was not in them, but in men who did not know how to give pleasure.

- And what can you tell about extras?

- People came to us for free and with great pleasure. We did not just invite viewers, we selected them according to the principle: whether they have something to say or not, whether they know how to talk, whether they will spoil the broadcast.

We wrote for three hours, and the program itself lasted 40 minutes. Why is that? The fact is that for the first two hours the audience was shy, but then they got tired, the frame weakened and they really said what they were thinking. This part has always been on the air.

- Have you had any pursuers?

- No, there were no pursuers. There were people who naively thought that I went through everything we talked about. I had to explain that if I did all this, I simply would not survive.

"Shoemaker without shoes"

- Have you ever wanted to know how the life of your heroes has developed? Or repeat the transfer?

- I do not think that our heroes would want to come and talk about it. They are all adults, yet the program came out more than 20 years ago.

As for the retransmission of the program ... It seems to me that it is relevant and, in a good way, should go on TV. Of course, on the Internet you can find anything you want about sex, but it scares me that there is a lot of all sorts of dirt. At the same time, a whole generation of young people grew up, whose parents cannot talk about it with them, cannot choose the right words. And in the end, no one is engaged in schoolchildren. So yes, it would be great if there was a program on Russian television where everyone was told in a normal language.

- You yourself had to talk with your daughter about sex?

- I confess right away, I'm a shoemaker without boots. I could not talk with Elizabeth-Anna on the topic of intimate relationships. She asked her friend to do it, and in return she herself spoke with her daughter. The daughter has a very close relationship with her grandmother, but what kind of advice can the grandmother have? "Take care of the honor from a young age," "Do not give a kiss without love."

Now the daughter is 18 years old. In the last year, we did not see much, because she went to study in America, but she returned for the pandemic, and we are catching up.

For the past ten years I have been working at home as a cerberus: at seven in the morning we get up, then go to training, then physical training, then we run to school, in the evening the second training, tutors. And I am such ... as a warrant officer: faster, got up, went. Of course, in such circumstances, you can’t build a special "mother-daughter" relationship with flowers and dresses.

But now we seemed to have discovered each other for ourselves. Finally, we had the opportunity to just sit, take your time, relax: eat your favorite food, watch TV shows, discuss boys. By the way, as it turned out, it is most convenient to do this specifically for TV shows. First, you need to look at something historical - so her dad demands, he even arranges an exam then. But if you shot back during the day, then you can already include what you like. And then you can discuss your favorite actors, then ask what kind of boys they like, how they will react if the boy comes up and says something, does he carry such and such things with him, what will he do if he is invited to drink. In a normal situation, she would say: “Mom, leave me alone!”, But here in the process she, having liberated herself, gives out all the necessary information.

- Did your daughter see your programs?

- She didn’t look at them; she’s not at all interested in it. Even when the mother-in-law offered, she said: “I will see my mother at home, why should I watch her on TV?”

- Do you follow Instagram sex workers?

- I do not follow. Maybe I'm not at that age to keep a close watch. And I would not compare: in 1997 we were the only ones who made such a transfer. Everyone was shy, but they had to talk, to choose the right words. And when you are a blogger, you are sitting in your kitchen, there is nobody around, you are not constrained by public censure. Both those who love and those who hate are watching you on TV. And in social networks, as a rule, subscribers still share the position of a blogger. And people learned to behave with haters.

I fainted if at least some letter came where they write badly about me. And now the more haters, the more viewers and subscribers come to you. In general, this suits bloggers, and their psyche is stronger than we had 25 years ago.

- It may seem that bloggers get popularity easily, especially compared to the era of big television. Does this upset you?

- No, this is a completely different world, and, I think, it is wonderful that it exists in parallel with the world of television. Someone can be incredibly popular with young people, but at the same time never appear on TV.

“I had to fight”

- How do you react when your appearance is considered your trump card?

- It seems to me that this is normal when you are selected out of a thousand applicants according to some principle. And my appearance did not become the reason that I was invited to television: if I could not cope directly with professional tasks, no one would call me.

  • © Photo from the personal archive

- And in your childhood you had problems because of your appearance?

- In the USSR there was racism, but everyday. Do not confuse it with the state when, for example, you do not have the right to study in some universities, as it was in America until 1953. In the Soviet Union, anything could be said to you in the back; someone might not want to be friends with you. When in newspapers - as it is true, even now - they write ads: "Let’s rent an apartment to people with a Slavic appearance."

The attention that I wanted to hide from was tiring. Someone looked with emotion, someone with irritation. Could pat without permission on the head and say: "Oh, what curls." They asked why I was black. First you try to explain that this is because my dad is from Africa, which I was told that since I was born in Moscow, it should be like everyone else.

I had to fight. My neighbor Sasha taught me how to make a “rose” out of a bottle, I even had a battle scar.

- Today, Afro-Russians say that racism manifests itself even in the hairstyle: you are born with curly hair, but the heroines have hair straightened on TV. What do you say about this?

- By the way, I introduced the term “Afro-Russians” and I am very proud of it. If we talk about hair, then this is nonsense. I straightened them for a completely different reason: in the Union there were no special compounds for African hair. Mom tore me tons of hair when she combed me. My hair was always short, which is why I was called a boy. And I wanted to be like a girl and dreamed that when I grow up, I will have long straight hair. That is, I didn’t straighten them at all in order to stop being like an African.

"Grandfather could be proud"

- What surprised you when you came to America for the first time?

- I went on an internship to the famous political newspaper Christian Science Monitor in Boston. It shocked me that the chief editor of this newspaper was a woman, her name was Kay.

I looked at this elegant woman, who had a husband and children, and saw with what respect men respected her, how she understood the international situation. I was just shocked. Here it is, feminism! In Russia, it was believed that only men can understand such a serious topic.

I came from a country where, except for the peasant magazine or fashion magazines, there were no women at all in the media leadership. And I just could not imagine that a “Truth” or “Izvestia” would be led by a woman.

We now know that people of any gender can perfectly understand a serious topic. And no one will question the words, for example, Zhenya Albats just because she is a woman, or the chief editor of RT.

I remember my first meeting with Margarita Simonyan. Since 2009, I worked in the CrossTalk talk show on the English channel RT, then I switched to the reference point program. And so she sits in front of me, and I think: “God, have I really lived to see the time when a young girl can lead a large channel, where are the thousands of men who will obey her and not question her position?”

- How do you feel about what is happening in the USA now? Not afraid to let your daughter go to school?

- For her I am not at all worried, especially since there is no longer looting on such a scale. I have many friends who go to peaceful multimillion-dollar rallies, we call up every day, they say that it’s not scary there.

- When the first news about the protests in America went, what did you feel?

“My grandfather is from Mississippi.” His great-grandfather is a former slave. He was freed by a very educated man - by the way, his master taught him to read - and subsequently became one of the richest African-Americans. Kukluksklanovtsy could not survive this humiliation and burned his house, the family was miraculously saved.

Grandfather was a very talented person, one of the first African Americans to graduate. For many years, for obvious reasons, could not find a job. He participated in demonstrations in New York for the rights of African Americans, was beaten by police officers, which caused health problems and as a result, he died from kidney failure.

Grandfather devoted his life to the struggle for civil rights. And if he is looking down at us now, then, I think, he is very proud of what is happening in America. The problem of social inequality still exists, as is the problem of police violence against African Americans. But he could hardly have imagined that because of the murder of an African American the whole country would rise, and not only the black, but also the white population. Therefore, I think he smiles, is proud and applauds. And if I were now in America, then I would also be among the peacefully marching people.